The TV/Film Thread

Simon · Post by **Simon** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 11:27 am

I say go for a naimated version of FANS! I loved it so far, and an animated version would be cool, but live action... *SHUDDER*, no that's a bit on the scarry side.-Simon
simonsworld.keenspace.com

Psiogen · Post by **Psiogen** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 11:50 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by T Campbell:
Should FANS pursue the film and television markets?
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>In the immortal words of Pokey the Penguin, <strike>"YES."</strike>------------------
Sylvan
<A HREF="http://spork.keenspace.com" TARGET=_blank>A God's Life</A>, the new comic by the award-losing author of <A HREF="http://spork.keenspace.com/spork.html" TARGET=_blank>Spork</A>.
"Sylvan is a misunderstood artistic genius..." --Aaron Reiser

Doublespeak · Post by **Doublespeak** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 12:09 pm

Right off the bat, I will tell you that if Fans! Became a print comic I would buy it. If you want to take that plunge again I am behind you, and would buy every issue and introduce it to my friends. Same goes with any novels.As for TV, that is a bigger and murkier step. I would assume that if you were to take the jump to TV that you would abandon the web comic entirely. That would sadden me, and everyone else, because Fans! is one of the best comics on and off the web, but the chance to see it on the small screen could be worth it. I don

Strangeone · Post by **Strangeone** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 12:41 pm

A live action series, if done properly, sounds fun. Heck, I'd even volunteer to write/direct episodes if I were allowed. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">The main problem that it might have is the copyright issues with various productions. Some might not be such a problem, but the more blatent parodies (Miller and Sully) would have to be altered/removed completely.

Kitsune76 · Post by **Kitsune76** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 12:55 pm

As a writer (read 'insane girl who cannot stop dreaming, even if you paid her'). I totally understand the place you're at right now. Taking creativity to the next level is increadibly difficult and knowing where and how is even worse.However, I have (unfortunately) several thoughts of the negative kind on this.1) In terms of movie projects I only have two words for you - Neil Gaiman. Now, Ilove Neil's work and the guy himself is pretty cool. But after Sandman hejust fell off the creative map for 5 years, only producing the English language script for Princess Monoko. I'm not 100% sure of this but I *suspect* he got dragged into the Hollywood world and was trapped there for a long while almost, but not quite, getting various projects going forward...which then fell down due to the evil that is The Hollywood System (hell, he wrote a short story based on a mixture of events and ideas on that subject).Then again, Neil was and is a bit of a freelance when it comes to projects whereas you have a firm and concrete concept you're fighting for. So that could make it easier.2) In terms of TV, the biggest advantage and disadvantage there would be 'Buffy the Vampire Slayer'. Buffy has opened the doors for a *lot* of interesting and new approaches to TV sci-fi/fantasy, and 'Fans!' could take advantage of that. Well, it could have about a year ago. Now I suspect that the whole 'we need another Buffy' thing is prolly going to be fading.On the other hand, they might want to like it *because* they want another Buffy. The adaptationo f the Pern books fell down because WB wanted something that was hip and young and teenagery and slangy. Which could scupper htings from the start.I also think 'Fans!' might have problems because its subject matter isn't really highly respected outside certain worlds, and TV and Movie people aren't in those worlds.At the end of the day, it's your project and these are only thoughts <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif"> But I'd suspect you'd stand a better chance with TV than film, because even if it went pear-shaped, you'd still escape with your soul intact. And I think if done well, Fans! could be a slow vburning classic a la 'Buffy'.Just sell up Alisin and Rumy as wild, sexy chicks, oneo f whom is bi, and they'll buy you in a second <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">3) In terms of a novelisation, I'd say take *extreme* care. With a novel you're really out there on your own, relying on your creativity and yours alone. Thast's not to say you're a bad writer <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif"> But you don't have someone to back you up in terms of your visiono f what shouldh appen where and when. I speak from experience, I've written a novel (unpublished, sucks, don't ask) and do a regular comic strip, and the latter is much easier in that you get he boost from the other person's art.Eh, OK, that's all I can really thinko f saying. It's not really useful, just sharing my thoughts in case they help.Kitsune
(Your disco needs you!)
------------------
<A HREF="http://kitsune76.keenspace.com//" TARGET=_blank>C.Ulture Shocked</A> It's British.But not in a good way...

Bevan · Post by **Bevan** » Sat Dec 08, 2001 12:58 pm

Personally, I think that Miller and Sully could be easily altered.The things that I find most interesting about them:1) Miller is a fanboy/occult fanatic who's obsession became his job.
2) Miller is a hunter of the supernatural who becomes a supernatural creature to escape his bosses.
3) Miller and Sully's love for each other, and how that convinced them to escape.
4) The fact that out of misplaced honor, they created the fans to be their replacements to justify their departure.With the possible exception of #1, none of these are taken from X-Files. Change their name, their appearance, and some slight personality quirks, and they would no longer be X-Files parodies (inspired by X-Files, sure, but not parodies).Ironically enough, I find Miller and Sully more interesting characters than the people they parody.

GarrisonBeckett · Post by **GarrisonBeckett** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 3:43 am

L.A.'s a nice place, I have family there. (On that note, T, please don't hit on any college Froshes last name of Hopper ...) ^_~Personally, I would aim for Comedy Central -- if South Park is any indication, they're willing to take ventures into new avenues; especially if you go with Martiza's idea of the B&W comic. And a Kevin Smith connection would be fantastic ... Bluntman and Chronic crossover??? I think he was shafted with the animated "Clerks" show, and may be interested in another forum ... or maybe even Trey Parker; we already know he's a FAN!, born and bred.Anyway, that's my nickel with three pennies change.--GB"I think I know precisely what I mean when I say it's a shpadoinkle day!"

Tom the Fanboy · Post by **Tom the Fanboy** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 3:55 am

*cracks knuckles, pops neck, and gets ready for a plethora of quotations*OK, Let's work on this in order.
Initial thoughts for T.Yeah, these'd all be great!
I'd go for cable, black and white if you're gonna follow the 5 year plan but color if you'll be making something new. Ya gotta go B/W for LtA. There's no other way! ..........unless of course you go for CGI with the Xenochiclets.If ya get a Movie go animated as well! I'd want a whole new story though, or maybe a plotline that added on to part of the webcomic. Liiiike.........the webcomic storyline would lead up to the movie and when the movie was released you'd begin it's webcomic version. Innovative!Novelization would be great! A look deeper into the process, it's like seeing what Jason gets! Hee hee hee, OK not really, but it's a fun way to think of it. Of course since you've already got it planned I'll just sit tight on that one.I've given my opinions on other media before (especially my musical thread, just imagine a stage play!) but here's some more! Radio drama, it's overlooked and it would be incredibly easier to produce. Of course I suppose there's not much market for it unless you sell it like a "book on tape...........or a "comic on tape" since the book would be your novelization! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin ... P>Animated comic, seen some pixel comics do it as a once a week thing and I think that it'd be a decent study in how animation would work with the characters. We saw a rough look at Tim and Guth this summer after all.I actually thought of this Idea awhile back when I remembered the shows on our local access. I was imagining doing a live reading of KODT at the shop and taping it. I just imagined taping a live reading of Fans and airing it on our cable access. The least it would do would be a pleasant distraction for the participants, and probably get the attention of any Fans! Fans viewing. Our local shop is going under so we're desperate for schemes to get more income and advertising is one of those.
Most of the above posts bring about the following thoughts.Those of you who mention ed Kevin Smith and Clerks: Everything I learned about developing an animated series I learned from the commentary track on Clerks: The cartoon. All the stuff about network flunkies, animator woes, and genral distrust I can definitely see happening with Fans! Although this was one example of how to show parody type stuff without getting into trouble!
[edit]All that work and I still hafta add. There's word on the vine of the Clerks Cartoon getting picked up by someone cool for a movie of all things! Despite the flop it made!To those who suggested T try print comics: He did, that's how Fans! Started. Take it from me, a kid who got involved way back during the FIRST crossover. With KODT that is! I remember when I mailed my letter to T begging him for all the issues and information on ordering something MORE. I of course got more than I bargained for in all of my issues. T had to move out of the print comic genre due to money and I'll let him give any details he chooses to. I'd love to see a return someday but I'm patient.Those who cited the Tick Live Action Show: Where is that thing or where was it!?!? I can't seem to retain any data on it!Those helpful volunteering souls: I think that T wants to keep porfessional but I agree with y'all. If there's anything we can DO for you T I'm sure there's hundreds of loyal minions. However I still wonder how many have bought stuff here. I think the best thing we can do for T right now is mail him ten dollar bills.........or checks for safety.To the one who suggested multiple webcomics: I think that it'd be fairly easy to get a cable show that had several cartoons on it by different artists. I think that this not only allows for more variety and marketability but it gives the show more support behind it and a wider fanbase. Just like all the people that came here due to the CRFH crossover. I can actually see a weekly show on Adult Swim or Comedy Central that had Fans and a couple other toons (webcomics would be cool but not neccesary) on it with like two toons a show covering various story arcs. I kinda think of something with story structure like MTV's Undressed, I'm rather embarassed that I can site it as a reference though.To the Loyal Lurkers: Welcome to you all, I may add your name to the Billberg page if you post more! Wink wink wink!To Psiogen only: Whooo!!! Pokey the Penguin! Whooooooo! It's hard to find references to him!Unlike so many before me I will NOT apologize for length for I am a glorious man!*snicker*OK, now gaze upon my sig and respect my authoritay!------------------
Tom the Fanboy <A HREF="http://www.geocities.com/tee-moss" TARGET=_blank>http://www.geocities.com/tee-moss</A> [begin Fans! code]
E(xkodt)M+FF+++A++W+++FCt++(s)Ip20000406f1mcKt+cCp- -bw++Ll++
[end Fans! code][This message has been edited by Tom the Fanboy (edited 12-09-2001).]

Alexi Strigoii · Post by **Alexi Strigoii** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 5:15 am

even better, put it on cartoon network, they hav that Adult swim thing going on now, a Fans tv show would fit right in

Maritza_Campos · Post by **Maritza_Campos** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 5:57 am

Maybe a good way to start would be to write a short Fans script for animation, and go with Cartoon Networks "experimental" What A Cartoon Show. Dexter, Cow and Chicken, Coward Dog, Johnny Bravo and others started here. Cartoon Network has a more adult audience than, say, Nickelodeon. Warner Brothers or Fox would be other options, but I don't have a very high opinion of what WB did to Baby Blues. Even MTV could be an option. I mean if they can produce Daria and other crap why not a good story like Fans?Another option would try the canadian tv. They seem a lot more willing to try more experimental projects. They make some really good cartoons too.The approach would have to be the same: adventure mixed with comedy and serial, with a bit of noir, no matter if it's color or b&w (tho b&w is weirder and therefore it attracts more attention)Maritza
CRFH.net

Yumitori · Post by **Yumitori** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 6:15 am

Coming in late...Others have said much of what I would, so I won't repeat it. Bottom line - if this is what you want to do, give it a shot.I do think, however, that one of the great things about Fans! is the community, here on the message boards. The chatter, speculation and silliness adds much to my enjoyment. I don't find that to be the case with other web comics, including ones with strong message boards. A bunch of fans chatting about a bunch of Fans! works well for me, though. You'd lose that with mass market, or see it splinter into hundreds of discussion groups.As for the parodies, it's my opinion that, if approached properly, you could not only get away with most (the Sesame Street ones would never fly), but you could easily get the actors involved to play their alteregos.

Muttley · Post by **Muttley** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 6:28 am

I'm late (I'm late, for a very important date: no time to say hello, goodbye, I'm late::: but I'm not the little white loony - - -)That'll teach me to run Win95 on an AMD K6-2/500. Rebuilding involves grovelling about in the dust and other unmentionable things, changing jumpers, trying to find the motherboard manual, trying to find the high-speed AMD patch, changing jumpers again. Then finding that your Microsoft castrated mouse (sorry, Intellimouse Explorer) induces strange behaviour in Microsoft's dialup networking. Bill Gates is living proof of the lack of the telepath gene in humanity: if there was any trace of it, he would be a greasy spot on the floor.Ahem. My thoughts on your question. Many good points have been raised already, so I'll try to be original.Fans! in any other medium will be different. Accept this, which probably means not trying to reuse the existing storylines.Moving pictures of any kind, animation or live action, have a different pace to print media, and require less storyline and more peripheral detail (if that makes sense). To put it another way, a good short story is about the right length to be turned into a full-length movie: a good novel is so dense that whole chunks must be cut to make it filmable. The creative process is significantly differentThat is not to say that you couldn't do it, far from it; I'm only trying to point out that, even with the same production team at its core, a Fans TV show would be different from the webcomic: not better: not worse: but definitely different.I would say that it would be wisest to embrace that difference to start with, and produce something that is undoubtedly Fans!, but making the best use of the medium (and not being restricted by trying to make it "just like the webcomic") It would most likely entail shorter, faster-developing storylines (with a larger arc, nothing mitigates against that), a congruent setting that wasn't identical to the webcomic (otherwise you risk the integrity of both) but with enough connections that the current fanbase can recognise it. Perhaps parallel storylines to the happenings in the webcomic, or concentrating on different main characters (with some commonality to the webcomic, to retain identity)There is not a huge amount of prior success to follow, is there? Look at Dilbert, for instance - - -Just a though, and probably out of line, but have you though about trying a syndicated strip? Three-panels-and-a-punch-line nonwithstanding? I don't know what the returns are like, though; may not be worth the effort.In general terms, fans are geeks and geeks are not popular. Dilbert managed it though . . .Worse, fandom is all about riding on the back of published works; you are a Fan of something that is already a success. Get the lawyers (spit) up to speed now, there is certain to be some comeback. But also get as many potential targets on-side, as guest-collaborators even. And to quote Zaphod Beeblebrox, put your analyst on danger-money, baby; now!I can see animation working better than live-action: most of the elements of Fans! stories involve unlikely physical manifestations. This being you: - something modern, use tweening for fillins, electronic collaboration between the production team, you know the kind of thing; may make production costs more achievable?B+W - will that fly? will anyone air a b+w cartoon? Given the startup costs, is going to colour that much more expensive?Um. Hope that helped. Sorry not to have been in line with the major discussions.Grrr. Arrgh.Muttley

Onion Boy · Post by **Onion Boy** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 7:14 am

Ummm...OK, I said pretty much all I wanted to in my earlier post, (incidentally, I was quite flattered when the next poster agreed with me so thoroughly, I've never been quoted before!) but I just took a look at the Fans T-shirts, and my sense of moral duty forces me to comment.
In a word (or two) - Ye Gods! No wonder you're making no money! You have...two T-Shirts, both with the exact same design, and the button that links to them is tucked gently away in the middle of nowhere, where nobody, but nobody, can see it! I will admit that I speak from no experience here, but how hard can it be to come up with an item of merchandise? You get together with the artist, you come up with a design together, he draws it, you send it off to the company specifying what you want it on, and Boom! Bob's yer uncle, cash flow guaranteed. Alright, maybe I'm talking through my hat here (or the Onion fumes have finally gone to my head) but please, at least make the link more prominent! Yank that sucker out from underneath the bedclothes, and haul his ass off to where he can be SEEN!
OK, that's all I have to say. May you dream of Onions.

NathanAlderman · Post by **NathanAlderman** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 7:43 am

T,Hmmm. TV or not TV? I'd have to say: be very, very careful.Smallville is, in my opinion, neither faithful nor impressive. The episodes I've seen thus far reduce the extremely interesting potential of the series into some kind of sappy, wit-deprived Clark The Kryptonite Slayer ripoff. When Pa Kent is the most interesting, least cardboard-y character on your "Young Superman" show, you know you're in trouble.LOTR is faithful because it's spearheaded by a die-hard Tolkien fan (and immensely talented filmmaker) who has clung to his own fanboy roots, and was greenlighted by an ambitious and visionary studio head with a knack for taking on off-kilter movies like Magnolia.As for Harry Potter... as one of the best-selling book series in human history, it has a legion of fans young and old who have memorized its every detail. Warner Brothers knew it couldn't mess with the story if it wanted this immense throng of people to open their wallets. (And frankly, the book was so good that the movie left me feeling like it was pretty much superfluous.)I'd say, unless you can find a safe harbor at someplace like Cartoon Network, where oddity and originality is rewarded, steer clear of TV and movies.But, as I've said many, many times before, I would happily shell out my hard-earned cash for a series of FANS TPBs, and push said TPBs on my friends with the same fervor that I do Carla Speed McNeil's outstanding <A HREF="http://www.lightspeedpress.com" TARGET=_blank>Finder</A>.That's my $.02.-- Nathan

Jarnor23 · Post by **Jarnor23** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 8:25 am

Go for it, T. Don't be discouraged by not getting things right off the bat, keep on trying.I could see live action, but only if done right. The benefits would be the greater publicity, easier audience access, being easier to have it taken more seriously, and just the thrill of seeing it done that way. The downsides would be every f-up trying to steal your idea, turn it into a kids with attitude take on monsters show, change everything that they think might be objectionable or not "marketable" enough, the huge budget, and bad acting. Gotta admit though, I'd love to see Duchovny and Anderson actually do Miller and Sully. (As totally unlikely as that is.) <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">Animation would be great, but it will be subject to a lot of the same problems, only slightly more managable. Definately keep Waltrip as the "head animation honcho" though, but probably hire out Korean animators or something cheap like that for the "filler" work. (In animation, only every few frames are done by the main people usually, and the frames between them to keep at 24 FPS are done by cheap labor.) Maybe a direct to video might work if you can't get a studio to jump on the idea after trying for a while.I'll bet you'd have a much more ready to spend money comic book audience if you were to try that again, although it would have to be new stories, of course. Dork Storm might be your best bet, unless you have a better relationship with Kenzer & Co. than I guess. The book idea sounds good as well.Definately do something to make some cash, even if it's just paypal donations or more merchandise. I'm quite willing to try to help out, and I'm sure some others are. Of course, this wouldn't be much money compared to other forms, but it might offset some of these costs. Please feel free to make your moichendizing more noticable. It currently seems to be hidden on the FANS page, at least compared to most webcomics.Whatever you do, best of luck, and I'm quite glad to have an excellent story to read daily!Jarnor23

Bushipunk · Post by **Bushipunk** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 9:03 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Onion Boy:
Ummm...OK, I said pretty much all I wanted to in my earlier post, (incidentally, I was quite flattered when the next poster agreed with me so thoroughly, I've never been quoted before!) but I just took a look at the Fans T-shirts, and my sense of moral duty forces me to comment.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Me again. I'm not an Onion Boy groupie, really, I'm not... This is just coincidence.On this subject, again, I agree, the link is hard to find - I didn't notice it until I'd been reading the comic for weeks already and stumbled across it when I'd exhausted all the other "extras". However, I can understand that it *isn't* always easy to come up with new shirt designs.That being said, I have to say, a shirt with a more recent cast-grouping (say, when the gang gathers before going in to rescue Shanna from the FiB headquarters) would be awfully nice.Bushi

Pirate Dave · Post by **Pirate Dave** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 10:08 am

After thinking about it, live action doesn't sound that bad after all.
I think most people activate their gag reflex when hearing "live action" because of movies like "Josie and the Pussycats".
But we already know it'll have a good writer, which solves most of that problem.

ThePsiCop · Post by **ThePsiCop** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 10:57 am

Just a quick $.02,In the TV market, I think the best bets, like other people have said, are places like Cartoon network, with its adult swim thing, or The Sci-fi channel. SciFi really hasn't had anything like it before, but they have taken risks and may be willing to look at it or give it a try. Plus, it's a place where the audience would most appreciate it in all likelihood. Personally, though a TV series would be great, I would love to see a novelization of some sort and would definitely pay money for it.

Nireena · Post by **Nireena** » Sun Dec 09, 2001 12:20 pm

At this point, people have pretty much stated in one form or another all of my arguments, but just to have it on record:1) Branching out is a good idea.2) I, for one, would really like a printed FANS!: either a compilation of all the stories to date, or a serial comic. I know Tom mentioned that you tried starting as one and it didn't work, but maybe now that you have a broader fanbase thanks to webcomics you'll have more success.3) Animation would be the next most preferable medium. It would preserve the look of the characters- their facial expressions and body language, etc- and you could carry off the special effects much more effectively and cheaply.4) Live action: *shudder* Even if you found people who were the perfect body types for each of the characters and who could act, the cost of a live-action movie would be prohibitive.5) TV series: burn out. It would be difficult to churn out ideas on that kind of a schedule and keep it fresh.So overall I vote for either a print comic collection or an animated movie. The animated movie doesn't have to be box office length: you could still promote it on Toonami or the SciFi channel as a TV animated movie (if that makes sense.. I'm starting to ramble..). No matter what you decide, T, best of luck!
Nireena

Blondlot · Post by **Blondlot** » Mon Dec 10, 2001 2:46 am

I'll be blunt.Live Action T.V
I'd give it a shot, but I wouldn't go out of my way to do so. I do, however, have a bullet saved for myself, just in case it turns out to be Dawson