Ways other cartoonists make money

[Deckard Canine]

RH, I've just remembered a few simple ways that some other Web cartoonists have encouraged donations -- ways that shouldn't compromise your integrity in any way:

1. "Kevin & Kell," for the past few years, has allowed people to sponsor the comic for $5 a day, crediting them by a name of their choice and presenting a one- or two-line message of their choice directly below the strip caption. (Past messages, however, cannot be found in any archive.)

2. "Little Dee," on its original site and not comics.com, has a link beneath each strip in the archives to buy that artwork. If it's already bought, the link will be replaced with, "This was bought on (date and time) by (username)." Note: When I pointed this out to Bill Holbrook, he said he does better to reserve originals as prizes for high patron-level packages. I don't know if Chris Baldwin's method is for you.

[Skull]

The key to "encouraging donations" is to increase ones' readership.

If you have only the same, static number of potential donors, eventually the well will run dry. As it apparently already has for Mr. Hayes.

The statistics for Google AdSense, and the common results for self-placed banner ads, suggests that between 2 and 5% of ones' readers/viewers will donate, click an ad, or purchase product. R. Milholland of Something Positive received his "years' salary donation" from 2.2% of his readers. Mr. Tayler of Schlock Mercenary ordered 5,000 books for over 400,000 readers, or enough for a little over 1%.

One can temporarily, and with considerable effort, draw slightly larger percentages for a brief period, but this can and does lead to "donor burnout". My photography forum was donor-maintained for two years, and I saw all of this first hand. But now traffic is sufficient that AdSense alone pays my bandwidth costs and around $500 a month over and above that. My custom banner advertisements net four times that.

But, that was only possible with a fair rate of traffic, just as any webcomic must have in order to turn a profit.

~fin.

[Skull]

Mr. Canine: I don't think there is any "original artwork". I was under the impression that much or all of the linework was created using a tablet, and the coloring is certainly done digitally. I suspect that any pencil-and-paper artwork is just a rough sketch to be traced or "inked" using the tablet.

That is a similar technique to what Mark Stanley does with FreeFall, and 'Gabe' does with Penny Arcade.

~fin.

[Axelgear]

Another neat way that I recall being used ages ago is Cameo Tickets. Basically, a limited number of cameo spots are up for grabs (Say, when the artist needs a convention) and the people buy a spot, then the artist decides where to put them. It's a roll of the dice to see if you'll like it or not, but it's fun all the same.

[Sasjhwa]

Another neat way that I recall being used ages ago is Cameo Tickets. Basically, a limited number of cameo spots are up for grabs (Say, when the artist needs a convention) and the people buy a spot, then the artist decides where to put them. It's a roll of the dice to see if you'll like it or not, but it's fun all the same.

Well that would be fun! Even without the money!

[Skull]

Mr. Hayes already does that. Or did, anyway. I know he's offered such an option, and there have been several cameos, notably the character "Calbeck" in a recent Nip & Tuck. That doesn't mean those were paid cameos, but Mr. Hayes has indeed offered them.

The problem here is that "cameo tickets", the Kevin & Kell type sponsorship, and Mayes' own "greeting cards" only pander to existing readers, and do essentially nothing to draw in new ones. To the contrary, the greeting cards, by displacing actual strips, has an entirely opposite effect in discouraging new readers.

I am not saying that one should not pander to ones' existing readers, what I am saying is that such pandering should not exclude or annoy new ones. And having several months in a row wherein a full half of the strips' content is not related in any way to the storyline or characters, does exactly that.

~fin.

[BrockthePaine]

That doesn't mean those were paid cameos, but Mr. Hayes has indeed offered them.

They are paid cameos. Look on the merchandise page for the price. I think a one-time cameo is $10 or $15, and an arc is about a hundred - that's just from memory though. I know there are a whole lot of arcs and cameos being ordered - the cameos for the Rebel Cry movie numbered at least 30, as I recall.

[Skull]

What I meant was that I had no way of knowing if a particular cameo was a paid one, or just a friend of Mr. Hayes' thrown in for fun. Yes, last I read Tuck, there were a wide array of "new" characters that were clearly cameos (given that they weren't necessarily "introduced", it was assumed that everyone knew who the characters were) but I obviously have no way of knowing which, if any, were paid.

But that's a moot point. The point is, Mr. Hayes has already offered or still offers that service, and taken at face value, it appears reasonably lucrative.

On this topic, the three major sources of income for a webcomic are, in no particular order, ads (AdSense, banner ads) swag (books, shirts) and donations.

There are a few others, such as paid cameos, but a lot of them, like wallpapers, K&K style "sponsorships" and the like, basically boil down to incentives to donate.

~fin.

[Deckard Canine]

You may be right, Skull, but I was going for a suggestion that RH might actually welcome. The ways that you've suggested he make the comics more broadly appealing would be compromises on his behalf.

[Skull]

And that's the part I simply don't understand. It seems the opinion is that my suggestions (primarily: Cleaning the archives, making a regular posting schedule for all three strips, and putting the "off topic" strips in their own gallery or even site) would somehow require a change of faith, or to compormise or alter Mr. Hayes' beliefs, or some other such nonsense.

And why is that? Cleaning out the archives of non-storyline strips and putting them in their own page, folder or gallery, is a simple, clear-cut improvement. As it is, reading through the archives of any of the three is like trying to read straight through a Choose your own Adventure book. Seperating out the individual styles, and letting each be read as it's own uninterrupted story, makes the reading more enjoyable, more likely to "hook" a new reader.

Making a fixed or regular posting schedule is of benefit to the reader, since he or she won't keep checking back, and each time being disappointed by a lack of updates. If the strip is supposed to be posted at, for example, midnight local on Tuesday night for a Wednesday update, the reader can click in on Wednesday, and be reasonably sure they will get a new comic.

I suppose I can see that asking that his Onions strips greeting cards be placed elsewhere can be seen as forcing an alteration of his beliefs, if one assumes that it's his belief that he must proselytize to anyone within earshot, whether or not they wish to listen.

Whether or not that's true, it's an extremely poor business decision, for a system that is, ostensibly, Mr. Hayes' sole business. Simply put, the reader visits to read Tales of the Questor, a reasonably well written and lightly illustrated furry swords-and-sorcery comic strip.

Except that for better than the last three months, fully half the new pages posted have been greeting-card filler that has absolutely nothing at all to do with the storyline or it's characters, or worse yet, condescending, narrow-view religious screeds not much more pleasant to read than a bad Jack Chick tract.

The strip is already barely weekly, and therefore a very tough sell as far as making the strip earn a living. Cutting the updates even further with filler hurts what draw the strip has left.

At no time did I say that Onions or the cards should be "stopped" or gotten rid of. What I did say is that they would almost certainly be better received when they're not being forced in the faces of those that didn't visit in order to read them.

It's like going to the theater to watch a good fantasy popcorn flick like Reign of Fire and instead getting Bowling for Columbine.

Mr. Hayes already has an outlet designed and maintained for his political and religious views, in the form of his LiveJournal. There are several LiveJournal-based comics out there already, so why not place the Onions there, where the audience would be far more receptive to that material, and it would have the benefit, if that's what Mr. Hayes desires, of increasing readership to his Journal.

That lets those that wish to read Questor, read it without interruption or influence, and lets those that wish to read Onions do the same.

It's not suppression, or persecution, or forcing a change in beliefs, or anything else. It's simply a matter of classification; you put various works where people will enjoy and read them most. You don't put an Ace Ventura DVD in with the subtitled independent studio art films on VHS at Blockbuster, and you don't stock the laxatives and feminine hygine products in the same aisle as the chips and soda at the supermarket.

How is any of that a "compromise"?

~fin.

[MikeVanPelt]

...my suggestions (primarily: Cleaning the archives, making a regular posting schedule for all three strips, and putting the "off topic" strips in their own gallery or even site)

For what it's worth, I have always thought that these are very good suggestions.

The problem is the way you say them, and some of the other stuff in your messages, that may be obscuring these good suggestions. (Think of the way you feel when you come here for "Tales of the Questor" and get "Hard Onions"...)

[Skull]

Indeed. Except that reading Mr. Hayes' posts and LiveJournal entries didn't, and don't, exactly give the impression of a sensitive, caring individual deserving of flowery praise and false kindness.

Mr. Hayes own manner is brusque, abrasive and confontational, and I, perhaps unintentionally, adopted the "When in Rome..." mindset upon reading his posts and forumulating a reply.

Should Mr. Hayes really expect such kindness and respect, when he himself doesn't show it to others?

~fin.

[Frigidmagi]

By that agruement you shouldn't have expected anything but harshness in reply yourself.

[Xellas]

I have to agree with Skull's suggestions here. While I do read Hard Onions when he puts it up and find it a very interesting (if extremely confrontational) strip, it is extremely jarring to go from the light hearted adventure of TotQ to the hardline political/religious commentary of Hard Onions. Also, like Skull said, new readers who happen to pop in when he's got up a Hard Onions strip are likely to take one look at that and run screaming for the hills, thinking "Oh god, not ANOTHER one!". That is (presumably) NOT the impression that Mr Hayes wants to send.

Seeing as he's separated TotQ, N/T, and GH apart, I fail to see why he wouldn't separate the Hard Onions content to its own place, in essence letting those who are interested read it at their leisure. I am reminded of how the author of SSDD has recently seperated his Church strips, which are personal reflection and political commentary that resemble Hard Onions in a way, to their own website complete with an archive.

As for the greeting cards, they aren't too bad. I just wish that he'd remove them from the archives really, because they honestly don't mesh well with the archives. Much like the Hard Onions posts, they break the thread of story that Mr Hayes is presumably trying to weave. Relegating them to their own archive or cleaning them out permanently would be an improvement (at least in MY eyes). Also, when a strip coincides with one of them, putting the strip at the top would be a minor improvement.

Speaking his mind aside, Mr Hayes really needs to reassess just WHY people come to his websites. They do not come to have strips like Hard Onions preach at them out of the blue. They don't come to see what random person decided to shell out $20 to send an internet card. They come for the most part to read his wonderful stories which he so kindly puts on the internet.

I'm not saying he should stop doing these side projects. In fact, I enjoy reading his Hard Onions strips (when I'm in the mood) because they give me an interesting viewpoint and get me thinking on subjects that I'd normally ignore. This triggers growth of my intellect by introspection on new topics, so I must thank him for that. But I would encourage him to keep a realistic perspective as to exactly WHY he's putting these strips up on the internet. He has stories to tell, and to tell a story you need readers. Taking a few minor steps to improve the website and make it more enjoyable for the readers is not compromising your integrety, it is making efficient use of your time and resources.

[Skull]

By that agruement you shouldn't have expected anything but harshness in reply yourself.

Did I at any point say I didn't? Point in fact, I fully expected any reply to be abrasive and confrontational, and I was not disappointed.

However, I did sort of expect an actual reply; whether he pointed out that suggestion A can't work because of reason B, or that he'd already tried suggestion C which produced result D, or whatever.

Instead he tries to say that book sales are unworkable despite hundreds of webcomics printing books... and that's about it. A few vague musings that implied that doing those things would be somehow contrary to his faith or beliefs.

I have been in Mr. Hayes' shoes, perhaps worse. I've been starving, had my utilites cut off, been evicted, had to move back in with my parents. But with work and determination, I now work for myself, selling only the sweat off my brow; photography in my case, but really, we're both just trying to convince people to shell out money for pretty pictures.

~fin.

[Canis_lupus]

rA few vague musings that implied that doing those things would be somehow contrary to his faith or beliefs.

I think it was referring to 34ing(making porn) his works for people.

[Canis_lupus]

rA few vague musings that implied that doing those things would be somehow contrary to his faith or beliefs.

I think it was referring to 34ing(making porn) his works for people.

[The JAM]

[...unWARP!!!]

Good evening.


Again, those suggestions were very similar to what I had also suggested. Well, I don't know about the regular updating, since I know other comic authors who, for periods of time, simply can't maintain their schedules, and Ralph has stated before that his situation isn't exactly comfortable at the moment.

Be that as it may, suggestions to improve things have been given. I'll say that his responses to those were indeed brash, however, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt in that none of us actually knows the complete set of circumstances that Ralph is in and that it's just POSSIBLE that though we may all see these suggestions as the perfect way to go, it's logistically impossible for Ralph to implement them at this time.

Should he say, "thanks for the suggestions, my loyal followers, but I have a better idea", or "I can't implement them at this time" or even "Please stand by" I'd be more than happy to see how things change.

Should he say, "I don't give a bleep about your suggestions, this is my home and my castle," et al, then we'll know that the root of this whole issue lies elsewhere.


Ralph, you know where to find me.


¡Zacatepóngolas!

Until next time, remember:

I

AM

THE

J.A.M. (a.k.a. Numbuh i: "Just because I'm imaginary doesn't mean I don't exist")

Good evening.

[WARP!!!]

[Skull]

I think it was referring to 34ing(making porn) his works for people.

Ah, I see. Though I don't recall that being mentioned, presumably it had either been proposed before, or was in one of the deleted threads. I didn't mention it, and I didn't see TheJAM or others do so either.

Yes, that would be a rather outré suggestion, and I can see why Mr. Hayes would object to it. Personally, I would be rather disappointed were he to stoop to that.

But, that wasn't even remotely one of my suggestions; perhaps Mr. Hayes confused me with someone else.

~fin.

[Wanderwolf]

Except that for better than the last three months, fully half the new pages posted have been greeting-card filler that has absolutely nothing at all to do with the storyline or it's characters, or worse yet, condescending, narrow-view religious screeds not much more pleasant to read than a bad Jack Chick tract.

Hey, now, Ralph's a lot better than Chick ever was or will be. I know; I've read "Dark Dungeons" in the original.

Yours with a wince at the memory,

The wolfish,

Wanderer