Looking good for the fans
- Bustertheclown
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Looking good for the fans
I'm curious. How important to y'all, as readers first, and creators second, is the look of a webcomic's website? Is the minimalist setup of a white page bearing comic enough, letting the content speak for itself, or do you more appreciate it when the creator at least takes the time to throw in a background color, and a few tables?
Also, while I've got you here, what about page and site content? How much clutter and extras are you willing to take in or surf, before it just becomes the visual equivalent of white noise?
Also, while I've got you here, what about page and site content? How much clutter and extras are you willing to take in or surf, before it just becomes the visual equivalent of white noise?
"Just because we're amateurs, doesn't mean our comics have to be amateurish." -McDuffies
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Re: Looking good for the fans
I tend to think a dark background color is nice - it's easier on the eyes than all that bright white. I use dark green, which is supposed to be easy on the eyes, but mostly I use it because my comic has lots of trees in it, and green's my favorite. It all works out well.
My theory on extras - as long as it's below the comic, it's easy enough to ignore. Too much on the side of a site can bother me, especially if it's brightly colored or blinks or something. If I like the comic, I'll look for the extras - they don't have to wave their arms and shout. I put the most important ones right below the comic, then I guess I'll just keep adding them in descending order.
My theory on extras - as long as it's below the comic, it's easy enough to ignore. Too much on the side of a site can bother me, especially if it's brightly colored or blinks or something. If I like the comic, I'll look for the extras - they don't have to wave their arms and shout. I put the most important ones right below the comic, then I guess I'll just keep adding them in descending order.
- Linkara
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Re: Looking good for the fans
At least a little bit of work should go into the site. Otherwise it just looks unprofessional. Then again, I don't think I've ever seen a well-drawn, well-written comic that didn't have at least some kind of formatting on the site.
- Cope
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I thought this thread was about wearing makeup to comicon
An eye-pleasing site design is nice, but I'm not too fussy. As long as it loads fast and doesn't melt my eyes, I'm generally content. When I was on a slower connection, I also preferred for there to be a set of navigation buttons (previous and next) both above and below the comic, so I could get the next page loading in a new tab while I read the current one.
I can't think of any time when I thought a website had too many features. As long as you don't do something like link to every cast entry individually on your front page, I can't imagine being bothered. If I'm not interested in reading, say, a glossary, then I just won't read it.Bustertheclown wrote:Also, while I've got you here, what about page and site content? How much clutter and extras are you willing to take in or surf, before it just becomes the visual equivalent of white noise?
Re: Looking good for the fans
A website is important. The website is what I'm using to READ it.
Let's start at the top, shall we: minimalistic and simple is my favorite thing on a webcomic. A nice banner, easy navigation, everything easy to find... my website's layout is approximately me, with my lower skills, putting out what I like seeing best in a webcomic. Simple, muted colors, darker colors, the ability to comment on individual comics, making it a bit bloggy but without the awkward navigation of blog archives... content, more than just a webpage with a comic on it... gallery, about page, forum, whatever... I like seeing these things, it shows that the comic people are trying to add some depth to it.
If it was just a white page with a comic slapped on it, I think I might decide it was a lazy creator and move on. I want a nice, simple site that doesn't distract from the comic. If I like the comic art style, I'm going to be LOOKING for extras, you don't need to force them on me, I'll WANT to find them... so it's nice when they're there. As long as nothing's shoved onto me besides the comic, news, advertisements, shoutbox whatever... I'm happy. It's nice to see I have the opportunity to join a forum or download wallpapers or read more about the background or the artist.
For example, the comic Zap... the layout bugs me because there's stuff on all corners, boxing me in, throwing stuff in my face BESIDES the comic. It's like I have no CHOICE. I love the comic, but so many ads, so much chaos, stuff is EVERYWHERE. Whereas, say, Legostar Galactica... I don't like the nav bar much, but it's easy to pay attention to the comic because most of the stuff is kept either on one side or underneath it. Tales of Pylea has a lovely site navigation, in my opinion... everything is simple, doesn't distract from the artwork, and works well with it. It won't stop me from reading if I REALLY like the comic, but it won't stop me from complaining either.
I prefer stuff kept underneath the comic, myself. If notes are necessary to understand it then you're not a good enough writer. Things like advertisements are great, but too many and your readers will be too distracted by them to read. Extra pages should be kept in a nice nav bar on the top and bottom, in my opinion, and the main thing I should be able to see when I click on it is the comic. But once I've read that, you want to keep me around, so it's good to have other things for me to check out if I want. Your notes on today's comic, your extra features, whatever. It becomes visual white noise for me, I think, when I click on the site, and half or more of it isn't comic, without having to scroll much. (This isn't including your top banner and navigation, generally.)
Let's start at the top, shall we: minimalistic and simple is my favorite thing on a webcomic. A nice banner, easy navigation, everything easy to find... my website's layout is approximately me, with my lower skills, putting out what I like seeing best in a webcomic. Simple, muted colors, darker colors, the ability to comment on individual comics, making it a bit bloggy but without the awkward navigation of blog archives... content, more than just a webpage with a comic on it... gallery, about page, forum, whatever... I like seeing these things, it shows that the comic people are trying to add some depth to it.
If it was just a white page with a comic slapped on it, I think I might decide it was a lazy creator and move on. I want a nice, simple site that doesn't distract from the comic. If I like the comic art style, I'm going to be LOOKING for extras, you don't need to force them on me, I'll WANT to find them... so it's nice when they're there. As long as nothing's shoved onto me besides the comic, news, advertisements, shoutbox whatever... I'm happy. It's nice to see I have the opportunity to join a forum or download wallpapers or read more about the background or the artist.
For example, the comic Zap... the layout bugs me because there's stuff on all corners, boxing me in, throwing stuff in my face BESIDES the comic. It's like I have no CHOICE. I love the comic, but so many ads, so much chaos, stuff is EVERYWHERE. Whereas, say, Legostar Galactica... I don't like the nav bar much, but it's easy to pay attention to the comic because most of the stuff is kept either on one side or underneath it. Tales of Pylea has a lovely site navigation, in my opinion... everything is simple, doesn't distract from the artwork, and works well with it. It won't stop me from reading if I REALLY like the comic, but it won't stop me from complaining either.
I prefer stuff kept underneath the comic, myself. If notes are necessary to understand it then you're not a good enough writer. Things like advertisements are great, but too many and your readers will be too distracted by them to read. Extra pages should be kept in a nice nav bar on the top and bottom, in my opinion, and the main thing I should be able to see when I click on it is the comic. But once I've read that, you want to keep me around, so it's good to have other things for me to check out if I want. Your notes on today's comic, your extra features, whatever. It becomes visual white noise for me, I think, when I click on the site, and half or more of it isn't comic, without having to scroll much. (This isn't including your top banner and navigation, generally.)
Re: Looking good for the fans
I prefer simple. I don't like it when I have to wait for a billion pictures to load every page. You really don't need to illistrate every link button, people. The only picture you need is your comic page, everything else is extra.
Also I've run into many "fancy" webpages whose frames cause the comic to require scrolling in multiple directions. That's a big no go.
Also I've run into many "fancy" webpages whose frames cause the comic to require scrolling in multiple directions. That's a big no go.
- McDuffies
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Re: Looking good for the fans
Site isn't important for me to decide whether I'll read a comic or not. It depends only on a comic itself. Site does make experience of reading more or less pleasurable though.
One kind of site that can put me off, though, is the site that loads terribly slow, specially since I've been on dial-up for years. It's bad enough when sites have cluttered main page, where author has put so many vote buttons and link banners and other stuff, each one of them a burden on my connection, but when he does the same with archive pages, there's no way I'll read.
I'm not exactly keen on sites that aren't intuitive enough, I expect to find everything I want from the first try. I don't want to have to learn how to use the site so I expect a usual menu, and navigation where I don't have to think twice where to click to get to the next page.
I like when a site has a lots of additional material. I'm usually not interested in pages that describe the world the comic is happening in (it should be shown in the comic, not told elsewhere, I think), but I like to find icons, banners, guest comics... since I change my wallpaper three times a week, wallpapers are usually the first thing I look for after reading a comic I like. If I like a comic, I'll also check out cast page too, if nothing then to see if the author had a different outlook of the characters than I did.
One kind of site that can put me off, though, is the site that loads terribly slow, specially since I've been on dial-up for years. It's bad enough when sites have cluttered main page, where author has put so many vote buttons and link banners and other stuff, each one of them a burden on my connection, but when he does the same with archive pages, there's no way I'll read.
I'm not exactly keen on sites that aren't intuitive enough, I expect to find everything I want from the first try. I don't want to have to learn how to use the site so I expect a usual menu, and navigation where I don't have to think twice where to click to get to the next page.
I like when a site has a lots of additional material. I'm usually not interested in pages that describe the world the comic is happening in (it should be shown in the comic, not told elsewhere, I think), but I like to find icons, banners, guest comics... since I change my wallpaper three times a week, wallpapers are usually the first thing I look for after reading a comic I like. If I like a comic, I'll also check out cast page too, if nothing then to see if the author had a different outlook of the characters than I did.
Re: Looking good for the fans
I like a pretty simple front page. If you want to have other content, then put up different sections for that. The front page should be all about presenting your comic. Stuff on the side of the comic is very distracting. An example of bad design might be Shortpacked (good comic but that right side bar is a terrible offense to the eyes.
Penny Arcade and VGcats also offend on that front, though they tend to put their commentary before the comic. I've always felt that the comic should stand alone with the commentary coming afterward.
An example of good design that hasn't changed much over the years might be Sluggy Freelance which uses a bar above the comic to navigate areas within the website (even though the Fanart section has been broken for ages) the comic front and center on the main page with news below the comic. Sluggy may very well be what's set the standard for webcomic site design. My own page very much imitates it in terms of layout, though I go with a darker design using blacks and grays to reflect the feel of the comic. Although white webpages with heavy graphics are fashionable right now I've always found black backgrounds to be easier on the eyes, at least when framing an image, though it can vary depending on the kind of comic you're presenting. Then again my HTML skills are bare bones basic HTML, no flash, no javascript, so style over substance is beyond me anyway.
Penny Arcade and VGcats also offend on that front, though they tend to put their commentary before the comic. I've always felt that the comic should stand alone with the commentary coming afterward.
An example of good design that hasn't changed much over the years might be Sluggy Freelance which uses a bar above the comic to navigate areas within the website (even though the Fanart section has been broken for ages) the comic front and center on the main page with news below the comic. Sluggy may very well be what's set the standard for webcomic site design. My own page very much imitates it in terms of layout, though I go with a darker design using blacks and grays to reflect the feel of the comic. Although white webpages with heavy graphics are fashionable right now I've always found black backgrounds to be easier on the eyes, at least when framing an image, though it can vary depending on the kind of comic you're presenting. Then again my HTML skills are bare bones basic HTML, no flash, no javascript, so style over substance is beyond me anyway.
Re: Looking good for the fans
A good site design won't necessarily convince me to read a comic, but a horrible one may convince me not to read it. The background (and buttons) should somehow match the comic, or feel appropriate.
- Joel Fagin
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Re: Looking good for the fans
I've babbled on about all this stuff before in my tutorials, so I'm not going to re-write the lot. A quick summary, then.
The website should be professional looking. That is, not necessarily beautiful but at least well laid out and consistent. The less on the site the better, too, since that takes away visual clutter and distractions to the comic. Colour comics need a one or two tone webpage so they stand out. Black and white comics (oddly) stand out well on anything. Comic on the front page (Penny Arcade gets excused because it's not a comic website - it's a gaming website) with a clear field on either side so it stands out. Keep the rest of the junk underneath it where people can get to it if they want to.
- Joel Fagin
The website should be professional looking. That is, not necessarily beautiful but at least well laid out and consistent. The less on the site the better, too, since that takes away visual clutter and distractions to the comic. Colour comics need a one or two tone webpage so they stand out. Black and white comics (oddly) stand out well on anything. Comic on the front page (Penny Arcade gets excused because it's not a comic website - it's a gaming website) with a clear field on either side so it stands out. Keep the rest of the junk underneath it where people can get to it if they want to.
- Joel Fagin
- Pimpette
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Re: Looking good for the fans
If I'm going to read a comic I generally don't care what the website looks like.
Exceptions:
a) if the website is too confusing or too annoying to navigate. If I can't figure out how to find your comic and read it in order in a short space of time, I will simply get irritated and close it down.
b) if the website takes a bazillion years to load. I have a quick internet speed, so if your website is taking more than the usual five to ten seconds to load, I will become uppity and just leave.
c) if the website burns my retinas I will run screaming and crying into the night.
Exceptions:
a) if the website is too confusing or too annoying to navigate. If I can't figure out how to find your comic and read it in order in a short space of time, I will simply get irritated and close it down.
b) if the website takes a bazillion years to load. I have a quick internet speed, so if your website is taking more than the usual five to ten seconds to load, I will become uppity and just leave.
c) if the website burns my retinas I will run screaming and crying into the night.
- TheSuburbanLetdown
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Re: Looking good for the fans
It's pretty important. It's gotta be logical look good. It doesn't have to be flashy or complex; it can be simple. In fact, simple is better since the comic is the main attraction.
- Redtech
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Re: Looking good for the fans
If the site looks better than the comic, then that is a real problem! But it is grossly underestimated how a site can compliment a comic, or it's style and themes.
- Warofwinds
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Re: Looking good for the fans
This is a rather in-depth question! I was interviewed about it, if you care to read the whole thing about my philosophy. The short version is that a website should be the "art gallery" of your comic. No one wants an overcluttered, or unpretty, site. It should be pretty and simple, and meant to display your work, not out-class it.
Pages you should definitely have are archive, cast about (yourself AND the comic, plus contact info), and you'd probably want a links, gallery and maybe an "extras" page.
Pages you should definitely have are archive, cast about (yourself AND the comic, plus contact info), and you'd probably want a links, gallery and maybe an "extras" page.
- Redtech
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Re: Looking good for the fans
I never knew "Gayer-online" could be so professional. Saying that, I don't believe that a "whois" page is that useful. I'm sure no one needs to know I handle urine for a living. I just remembered what mine looks like, and I thought I was ugly.
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Industrialpowersart
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Re: Looking good for the fans
I agree with KWill. Your site can be gorgeous, but if your comic isn't that good, I won't read it anyway. If your comic is awesome but your site gives me a headache, I might not bother. That said, I am not entirely pleased with my own comic site yet and think we need to perfect a few things.
I like dark or otherwise muted backgrounds because I have sensitive eyes. I hate waiting for pages to load because it messes with my enjoyment of the story. If the page took a billion years to load and I find out the art is beautiful, I'll forgive you. If I find out it was because of annoying flash animation, I won't. Everything should be simple, easy to understand, and not distracting. I wish someone woud explain all this to everyone on myspace, but I digress. I will deal with as many extras on a page as actually benefit the reader. I don't care about your best friend's blog, but character sketches, background story, and timelines are all things I don't mind at all.
Basically, your art, your words, and your site should be the best that you can do at all times. If you improve in an area, your comic should represent that improvement. Should I actually learn HTML, you guys'll be the first to know.
I like dark or otherwise muted backgrounds because I have sensitive eyes. I hate waiting for pages to load because it messes with my enjoyment of the story. If the page took a billion years to load and I find out the art is beautiful, I'll forgive you. If I find out it was because of annoying flash animation, I won't. Everything should be simple, easy to understand, and not distracting. I wish someone woud explain all this to everyone on myspace, but I digress. I will deal with as many extras on a page as actually benefit the reader. I don't care about your best friend's blog, but character sketches, background story, and timelines are all things I don't mind at all.
Basically, your art, your words, and your site should be the best that you can do at all times. If you improve in an area, your comic should represent that improvement. Should I actually learn HTML, you guys'll be the first to know.
Re: Looking good for the fans
I preach the crap out of how important a website design is to your audience.
A website design is what you are framing your artwork in. You go to a gallery that is displaying fine arts and find Van Gogh's framed in banana peels. I will leave it up to the artist to determine how to display their art work but there are few fundamental aspects for smooth reading that should always be adhered to when creating a webcomic website.
#1 Have the foward/next/prev/back buttons or whatever you choose to call them clearly understandable. Please have these on top and bottom of your displayed frame. This makes it easier as a reader to get around. Less scrolling the better.
#2 Everyone wants to make money... but holy crap, ads in moderation please.
#3 Might be an opinion but a centered layout is most aesthetically pleasing. Imagine a painting framed with a 1inch border on the left and a 3inch border on the right.. funky.
#4 Website is the first impression someone will have with your webcomic. Whether you realize it or not. It is the same thing of how we judge people on the way they dress. It might not be right... but we do.
I understand with some free hosting sites, there might not be much degree of customization but if you are going to have a zebra background behind black text... you best have one hell of a funny comic because people are probably not going to come back.
A website design is what you are framing your artwork in. You go to a gallery that is displaying fine arts and find Van Gogh's framed in banana peels. I will leave it up to the artist to determine how to display their art work but there are few fundamental aspects for smooth reading that should always be adhered to when creating a webcomic website.
#1 Have the foward/next/prev/back buttons or whatever you choose to call them clearly understandable. Please have these on top and bottom of your displayed frame. This makes it easier as a reader to get around. Less scrolling the better.
#2 Everyone wants to make money... but holy crap, ads in moderation please.
#3 Might be an opinion but a centered layout is most aesthetically pleasing. Imagine a painting framed with a 1inch border on the left and a 3inch border on the right.. funky.
#4 Website is the first impression someone will have with your webcomic. Whether you realize it or not. It is the same thing of how we judge people on the way they dress. It might not be right... but we do.
I understand with some free hosting sites, there might not be much degree of customization but if you are going to have a zebra background behind black text... you best have one hell of a funny comic because people are probably not going to come back.
Re: Looking good for the fans
Most of my opinions on webdesign for comics have already been mentioned, but I'd like to chime in my sentiments anyway.
I think that good webdesign isn't going to save a bad comic, but bad design can kill a good one. If I can't find where to lick to get to the next page, or if I can't easily navigate the archive, I'm going to leave.
I enjoy it when comics I'm reading have extras, but I prefer them to be out of the way. That way I can find them when I want to, but they don't distract from the comic itself.
Also, not a lot of comics have one, but I really like it when comics have a bookmark feature so that I don't have to try to remember what comic I'm on in the archive. ComicPress has it built in but I think it's a feature that's under-utilized, in general.
I think that good webdesign isn't going to save a bad comic, but bad design can kill a good one. If I can't find where to lick to get to the next page, or if I can't easily navigate the archive, I'm going to leave.
I enjoy it when comics I'm reading have extras, but I prefer them to be out of the way. That way I can find them when I want to, but they don't distract from the comic itself.
Also, not a lot of comics have one, but I really like it when comics have a bookmark feature so that I don't have to try to remember what comic I'm on in the archive. ComicPress has it built in but I think it's a feature that's under-utilized, in general.















