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Jesusabdullah
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Post by Jesusabdullah »

skyman8081 wrote:Also, as somebody who was home-schooled for several years, this does nothing but affim my belief that home-school tends to attract the less than sane parents.
I too was home-schooled for a couple of years, and I agree with you. I think it's because of the reasons that people choose to home-school. My parents, I think, first tried it as an experiment, to see how it fit, and did it later because we moved to a fairly rough community (Bethel, a large native village, which is perhaps a surprise). Other people, on the other hand (from my impression) choose to home school because they don't like the standard curriculum, which usually means they want more religious doctrine in their learnin'.

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Soul_Thief wrote:how odd will the family size look on the kids' FAFSA forms?
More like, how awesome would that look? For them, anyway. :D

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Post by NakedElf »

Anything rare as far as human behavior is likely to be done up by crazies. I was homeschooled because private schools cost a lot of money, my dad had just quit his job due to coming down with 'terminal illness' so we had a lot less money, public schools suck, and my mum wanted to spend more 'quality family time' together now that one of us was up and dying.

Admittedly, my mum did kind of go crazy in there, but that was more related to the living with a terminally ill husband than the homeschooling.

(He's still alive. He'll probably outlive us all.)

I plan on homeschooling my kids at least for elementary school because A. I'm smarter than most elementary teachers and can certainly teach my kids to read, and B. I have no happy memories of elementary school, just memories of being pushed around by bigger kids. I didn't know it then, but I was literally half the size of many of my classmates, not to mention socially awkward as all crap. So was my husband, and therefore likely so will our own kids, so that's years of shittiness I'd rather not inflict on them.

I actually liked middle and highschool (what I saw of it) and am not confident in my ability to teach AP physics, so I figure on sending them off to regular school for that.
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NakedElf wrote: I plan on homeschooling my kids at least for elementary school because A. I'm smarter than most elementary teachers and can certainly teach my kids to read, and B. I have no happy memories of elementary school, just memories of being pushed around by bigger kids.
That's why I wouldn't homeschool. I'd want my kids to learn it's rough out there.
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Post by Soul_Thief »

as for the contraception and other outdated doctrines, the current Pope is completely renovating John Paul II's entire papacy. current pope (forgot his name, oops) is a backwards, controlling lemon. he's trying to reroute the entire Catholic faith back into the 1600's. and i'm not mocking my religion in this one, i'm stating a widely held fact.

all of the catholic churches i've been to (i'd say 20-30) don't give a crap about contraception. actually, the bigger thing is abstinence, but mainstream media is turning virginity into a sin.
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Post by Jesusabdullah »

yeahduff wrote:
NakedElf wrote: I plan on homeschooling my kids at least for elementary school because A. I'm smarter than most elementary teachers and can certainly teach my kids to read, and B. I have no happy memories of elementary school, just memories of being pushed around by bigger kids.
That's why I wouldn't homeschool. I'd want my kids to learn it's rough out there.
Also, the kids will have to develop their social skillz sooner or later, and it's better that they start when they're little than to have to try to catch up as a socially awkward preteen, I think. I know I missed out during my brief time home-schooling. Then again, if you live near other people anyway, maybe it will be less of a problem (I live in The Sticks).

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Post by Mr.Bob »

I have almost forty uncles and aunts. Catholic prorogation is still topical for me. *folds arms*

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Soul_Thief wrote: as for the contraception and other outdated doctrines, the current Pope is completely renovating John Paul II's entire papacy. current pope (forgot his name, oops) is a backwards, controlling lemon. he's trying to reroute the entire Catholic faith back into the 1600's. and i'm not mocking my religion in this one, i'm stating a widely held fact.
Benny's more conservative than Johnny was, but it doesn't mean he was down with contraception. American churches might play up abstinence more than deride contraception, but official doctrine is and has been in favor of rawdog.

Can't argue with your characterization of Benedict, though. I mean, yeah, he's a pope, but damn.
Soul_Thief wrote: actually, the bigger thing is abstinence, but mainstream media is turning virginity into a sin.
Get that one from a Chick tract or is it your own outrageous hyperbole?
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Post by Princess »

The elder children must do a lot of baby sitting
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Post by Dr Legostar »

princess wrote:The elder children must do a lot of baby sitting
well obviously the parents don't get out much.. or maybe they do... hard to say.
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Post by McDuffies »

I don't think it's weird at all. My dad had like....13 sibs. My mom about 7. My aunt has ten kids alone. I think she's still having babies. Her oldest is...30+ and her youngest is maybe under 10. Having a lot of kids in a village community isn't bad because you have more hands to help out with farming and taking care of younger children or elderly.

But in the states, I think it's ridiculous because things don't work out that way.
You'll agree that having more hands to work is an awful reason to have more children. Children aren't, like, robots - oh, let's make a few more, they'll come in handy.
My grandfather had seven or eight of brothers, and so did my grardmother - reffering to two of my grandparents whose families I'm familiar with. But you have to compare what their families took like to see the real picture. My great-grandfather was an uneducated, lazy, patriarchal man whose children hated him so much that some of them wouldn't attend his funeral. My great-grandmother was a housewife whoused to get beaten up on a regular bases, a woman who hardly had time to do anything but cool, work around the house, and carry a baby in the stomach. I'm sure that any normal woman would like more of life than this.
The times were such, people thought that all you had to do was bring a baby to the world, and your parenting duties are over. The child was lucky that you kept him in the house until he's 18, even though the child deserved his loaf of bread by working in the field ever since he/she was able to walk. Oh, and also, at the dinner, a father would sit and eat as much as he could, and only when he's done, children and mother were allowed to sit and eat. When a baby died at birth due to unproper medical care, father would just shrug shoulders and say "God gave, God took away". Allegedly, my grandfather had more siblings who never got to day two, though it's one of no-no topics in my family.
I dunno about others, but this sounds like dark times to me. I'm glad that we're over that mentality, and I see families like this as some sort of remaining anachronism from those times. Today we know that parenting doesn't end when a baby leaves a stomach and that child needs care, attention, good role model, not to mention fair amount of money, from it's parents.
I saw a program about them on TV the other night. While I'm sure I disagree strongly with them about, well, most everything, given that I'm a liberal atheist with a decent background in science, they seemed like very happy people.

They're not my family, and not the family I'd chose, nor the names and clothes I'd like, but they seem happy with their lives and their choices, which means they're doing better than a hell of people out there.

Are the kids getting a lot of attention from their parents? Well, they're homeschooled, they live with tons of caring relatives, and their parents don't spend all day watching TV. I'd venture to say that these kids actually get more time with their parents than I got with my parents when I was a kid. (Of course, when you have a single working mom and split most of your time between school and nanny/daycare, that ain't saying much.)

Just because there's a bunch of you gathered around your mom as she reads to you doesn't mean she isn't reading to you...
I'm recluctant to believe that all the problems that plague one family, especially the ones unspoken, under the surface, would be evident in a tv show about them. You don't expect a ten-year old kid to come to camera and speak up: "I'm not getting enough attention I need to develop as a healthy individual."
Also on that last paragraph I have to strongly disagree. I've had some experience with kids in a hospital for homeless children, and I've seen how they're craving for attention. They have no financial problems as hospital is always getting a lot of donations - thechnically, they're well-situated; but there's never enough volunteers to give children all the attention they need. When we were called to volunteer, we were said "you don't need to do anything, just spend time with those children" and indeed it was true. As soon as you enter their ward, they start fleeing toward you, pulling your sleeves, tryng to get your attention from others, and in a matter of minutes they already see you as a parental figure, since they desperately need one.
And yeah, when you're reading to such large number of children, you're not reading to each of them. From their perspective, you're reading to everyone else but them.
I plan on homeschooling my kids at least for elementary school because A. I'm smarter than most elementary teachers and can certainly teach my kids to read, and B. I have no happy memories of elementary school, just memories of being pushed around by bigger kids. I didn't know it then, but I was literally half the size of many of my classmates, not to mention socially awkward as all crap. So was my husband, and therefore likely so will our own kids, so that's years of shittiness I'd rather not inflict on them.
When I attended grammar school, I was living in a village about twenty miles from school, and myfather was driving me to school. Naturally, I couldn't play with my school mates after school, since they all lived nearer, in the town, while I lived in a huge house with a huge backyard and no children to play with for miles around, except for my olded sister.
Though I partly attribute this situation to my interest in comics, I also blame them for my problems with interaction with people, introvercy and shyness, which became acute some years later. It's the problem I've been dealing with all my life and I only started overcoming it when I was about 20 and abruptly shifted to college enviroment. All my life I've been dragging some issues that are, I believe, at least partly due to that I didn't have the fair level of interaction with other kids.
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Post by Orinocou »

yeahduff wrote: And how does one make fun of Mormonism two posts after saying religion is off limits as far as mockery goes?

Edit/ oh, that wasn't you.
No, that was me who said it. Hi. It's one of my pet peeves, when people speak of religion- and of people's core beliefs- with disrespect.

Spending time in a university campus like I have, you sort of get the vibe that the majority of people equate "religious people" with being "sheltered", "lame", and "prudish"... especially that last one. As if being a virgin was something to be ashamed of. But I digress.

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Post by Soul_Thief »

i'm sorry for having that opinion, yeahduff. i just get horribly upset with being the freak in the building when the conversation turns to sex and i don't want to talk about it. i'd like to believe that by simply keeping your pants on, you can avoid problems like rampant STD's and babies born to incompetent/unwilling/unprepared parents, but then again, i'm rather idealistic.
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Post by Killbert-Robby »

Ah but you see the logic on this is a big skewed. If more people went out and had sex instead of sitting inside and avoiding it due to STDs and such, we'd have more CLEAN people out there, and therefore the chance of catching an STD would drop surely?

Sorry, I'm reading a wierd book :P I'm not all for wild rampant sex with everyone you meet, I just figured I'd throw this interesting view point out there.
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Post by McDuffies »

If people were abstining from sex that would indeed solve many problems with sexual diseases and unwanted pregnancies. However, for better or for worse that ain't gonna happen any time soon because there's no force in the world that'll stop teenagers anticipating sex and rushing into it.
The next most efficient solution for those problems is being informed about sex, it's risks and contraception. Therefore, it's good that people can talk about it freely nowadays.

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Post by NakedElf »

jesusabdullah wrote:
yeahduff wrote:
NakedElf wrote: I plan on homeschooling my kids at least for elementary school because A. I'm smarter than most elementary teachers and can certainly teach my kids to read, and B. I have no happy memories of elementary school, just memories of being pushed around by bigger kids.
That's why I wouldn't homeschool. I'd want my kids to learn it's rough out there.
Also, the kids will have to develop their social skillz sooner or later, and it's better that they start when they're little than to have to try to catch up as a socially awkward preteen, I think. I know I missed out during my brief time home-schooling. Then again, if you live near other people anyway, maybe it will be less of a problem (I live in The Sticks).
I don't intend on locking them indoors and never letting them talk to other kids or something stupid like that. When I was a kid my best friends were all kids who lived near me (none of them happened to be in my classes at school.) I actually enjoyed things like swim team, art classes, camping, etc.--fun things which involved other kids where I did make friends. I just object to the 'mandatory' nature of regular schooling and the shitty quality of much of it. I don't think you have to shove a kid into a room with 30 other unhappy people and one cranky adult for 8 hours a day 5 days a week for 15 years in order for them to be properly socialized--in fact, I think that's a *bad* environment for socialization compared to, say, just playing with other kids in the neighborhood.

I do think that by middle/highschool the kids would be better off socially in a regular school environment.

As for teaching them that life sucks, I think a visit to the Holocaust Museum will accomplish that fine. Or more generally, there's plenty of suffering and misery to experience in this world without purposefully inflicting it upon anyone.
mcDuffies wrote:I'm recluctant to believe that all the problems that plague one family, especially the ones unspoken, under the surface, would be evident in a tv show about them. You don't expect a ten-year old kid to come to camera and speak up: "I'm not getting enough attention I need to develop as a healthy individual."
Hence my use of the word 'seem'. They seem happy. That's all I have to judge from. Maybe they're actually really unhappy. Maybe they're happy now but will become unhappy later. Maybe they're actually all robots. Okay, probably not.

You would think that *everyone* would put on their happy faces in front of the camera, but a lot of people manage to go on TV and still make themselves look horrible... So I have to believe that they are either very good at image control (as far as they can while still having really bad taste in clothes and just sort of looking morally repugnant to me,) or are actually happy with most aspects of their lives.

I'm not them. I don't have some sort of weird complex where I think it's my duty in life and my key to salvation to pop out as many babies as possible. If I did, a life like theirs might actually make me happy.

I do strongly suspect that those kids *aren't* getting very much personal attention from their parents, but in contrast to the homeless kids, they have stable lives and stable family-group.
Soul_Thief wrote:i'm sorry for having that opinion, yeahduff. i just get horribly upset with being the freak in the building when the conversation turns to sex and i don't want to talk about it. i'd like to believe that by simply keeping your pants on, you can avoid problems like rampant STD's and babies born to incompetent/unwilling/unprepared parents, but then again, i'm rather idealistic.
Keeping your pants on won't stop you from getting raped.

Did you know that married people are some of the most likely to get AIDS?

There's no point to idealism if it doesn't accomplish your goal.
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Post by Jesusabdullah »

NakedElf wrote:I don't intend on locking them indoors and never letting them talk to other kids or something stupid like that. When I was a kid my best friends were all kids who lived near me (none of them happened to be in my classes at school.) I actually enjoyed things like swim team, art classes, camping, etc.--fun things which involved other kids where I did make friends.
Right, if you live in an area where there are other kids on the same street, then it's less of a problem--perhaps, even, not a problem. Where I grew up (and am living for the summer), the nearest kid(s) were/are miles away. I think my nearest friend lives at least seven miles away from me, if not more, including many miles of dirt/gravel road. I'd imagine that you would be living in a place more densely populated than this.

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Post by Komiyan »

Soul_Thief wrote:i'm sorry for having that opinion, yeahduff. i just get horribly upset with being the freak in the building when the conversation turns to sex and i don't want to talk about it. i'd like to believe that by simply keeping your pants on, you can avoid problems like rampant STD's and babies born to incompetent/unwilling/unprepared parents, but then again, i'm rather idealistic.
Condoms do that, and they're a lot more likely to help than asking people to ignore all their instincts and keep it in their pants. That will never, ever happen.
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Post by NakedElf »

jesusabdullah wrote:Right, if you live in an area where there are other kids on the same street, then it's less of a problem--perhaps, even, not a problem. Where I grew up (and am living for the summer), the nearest kid(s) were/are miles away. I think my nearest friend lives at least seven miles away from me, if not more, including many miles of dirt/gravel road. I'd imagine that you would be living in a place more densely populated than this.
I think the most 'rural' spot I've been contemplating moving to is in the middle of a housing boom... Man, I've been living in the city for so long, I've started thinking that anywhere with a bit of grass and trees where there aren't cars constantly zooming at you is the 'countryside' even what I'm actually looking at is a tract of suburbs...
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Soul_Thief wrote:i'm sorry for having that opinion, yeahduff. i just get horribly upset with being the freak in the building when the conversation turns to sex and i don't want to talk about it. i'd like to believe that by simply keeping your pants on, you can avoid problems like rampant STD's and babies born to incompetent/unwilling/unprepared parents, but then again, i'm rather idealistic.
Well, if you're being made fun of for remaining abstinent, that's not cool. But if you're lecturing others about "keeping their pants on," or you're merely insecure about your virginity, then I'm afraid the problem lies with you.

We're all so weird about sex. Virginity isn't a big deal. Whether you have it or you don't, whatever.
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Post by McDuffies »

What we can't make fun of virgins now? Then what the hell did we lose the virginity for?

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