Comics and realistic body image

Birdie · Post by **Birdie** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:43 am

I am a mediocre artist. I cannot draw boobs of my own and that's why I'm glad that there are brave souls like K-Dawg who will draw big boobs so I don't have to.

Help mediocre artists like me by not disgregaurding the greatness it is of the large boobed women.

TheSuburbanLetdown · Post by **TheSuburbanLetdown** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:53 am

I'm not really a big boob fan. I kinda like 'em on the small side I guess.

Rocknjosie · Post by **Rocknjosie** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:58 am

cat42 wrote:
Rocknjosie wrote:But the US department of justice reports that a woman is raped every two minutes.
I'm not saying that boys get raped as often as girls, I also believe that girls are molested and raped much more often than boys are, but also keep in mind, boys are alot less likely to report it...

Everytime I read a statistic like that though, it makes me 1. hate my gender just a little bit more, and 2. reminds me about how I think it might be a good idea to nuke this whole damn piece of rock out of existence.

well only about 25% of rapes actually go reported, so I think we're in the same boat there.

helixdq wrote:Well for the record i usually enjoy being "objectified" and i'm sure a lot of people do. Or they wouldn't work so much on their image, they wouldn't dress the way they do, talk, gesture the way they do.

It really makes me sad that you wrote that. The self hate you describe right there is exactly what bothers me.

And K-Dawg, you said,

"I draw what I want, when I want, how I want. If I want to make the characters with big boobs I will. I don't really care to make it different from everything else, or conform to anything else. I draw it because I want to draw it, I don't give a damn if you think otherwise.

Hi I am K-Dawg and that was my response. *bows* "

If you weren't overcompensating so much, and acting so freaking disgustingly macho, I might actually be inclined to respect your possition on creative freedom.

Black Sparrow · Post by **Black Sparrow** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:33 am

Josie, could you please quit it? This isn't supposed to be a philosophical debate, and it's not supposed to be a flame war. People have different opinions about what they like to see and draw, and everyone here respects those differences.

As for the rape thing: we're all aware of it. One of my best friends got raped, but she doesn't blame it on objectification. She blames it on lust. The truth is, girls have been objectified since the Stone Age (read: even before TV came out); that's just how society works. TV and comics are just a newer medium. Before that, it was books. Before that, it was Renaissance art. Before that, it was religious texts and mythology. Bringing up such an ancient issue in a forum full of comic writers is just going to get your head bitten off.

Noise Monkey · Post by **Noise Monkey** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:43 am

Macho schmacho! I dare say we ALL draw what we want how we want. I know I've never had a guy hold a gun to my head with someone screaming "draw bigger boobs" or "she's too fat, skinny her up!!" Let's be realistic here. We all make these choices and that K-Dawg was willing to put it out there that he does it just makes him honest about his decisions.

Birdie · Post by **Birdie** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:49 am

Rocknjosie wrote:If you weren't overcompensating so much, and acting so freaking disgustingly macho, I might actually be inclined to respect your possition on creative freedom.

Apparently you've never read K-Dawg's comic. His comic is a lovestory between a pair of monkeys and a frog and a godess of love. It's fucking adorable, and funny and you should think before you shoot your mouth off at every single thing people say. I wish I had a mallet right now because I'd put you in the timeout box. Just to give you enough to time to find out what crawled up your ass and died, and PULL IT THE FUCK OUT.

Black Sparrow · Post by **Black Sparrow** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 7:57 am

supernerdcore wrote:I wish I had a mallet right now because I'd put you in the timeout box. Just to give you enough to time to find out what crawled up your ass and died, and PULL IT THE FUCK OUT.

That's harsh...

Josie's a nice, smart person, from what I 've seen in other threads. This just seems to be a sensitive issue for her. Everyone has those. Please don't make it worse.

Wishmaster · Post by **Wishmaster** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:15 am

Rocknjosie wrote:
helixdq wrote:Well for the record i usually enjoy being "objectified" and i'm sure a lot of people do. Or they wouldn't work so much on their image, they wouldn't dress the way they do, talk, gesture the way they do.
It really makes me sad that you wrote that. The self hate you describe right there is exactly what bothers me.

I didn't read anywhere in helixdq's response where they hated themself. Are you sure it's not your self-hate we're dealing with here? That's what I have to wonder when someone hectors other people like this.

K-dawg wrote:I draw what I want, when I want, how I want. If I want to make the characters with big boobs I will. I don't really care to make it different from everything else, or conform to anything else. I draw it because I want to draw it, I don't give a damn if you think otherwise.

Hi I am K-Dawg and that was my response. *bows*

Rock on!

Blackaby · Post by **Blackaby** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:23 am

Histoire de Ma Vie

My artist and I met online through drawing and writing pornography and soon formed a strong alliance based on our shared love of drawing and writing pornography. We decided to combine our talents (in the fields of drawing and writing pornography) to form a comic as a way to give back to the community and consummate our forbidden passion. After much deliberation we drew up a list of our aims, which were as follows:

1) To draw sexy people with their tops off.

Obviously this led to a lot of worrisome questions with regard to morality and role-modelling within the community, but the biggest question, as I

CaptainClaude · Post by **CaptainClaude** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:23 am

You know what I'm gonna do?

All the guys in the comic will now have exaggerated crotch bulges.
Furthermore, Chest puppies is a great term.

I am RYClaude and that was my response *bows*

Pillywiggin · Post by **Pillywiggin** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:25 am

Interesting question. It's also one that I would have probably answered differently 5 or 6 years ago. I also come up with different answers if I'm talking about mainstream comics or webcomics.

In published comics it does tend to bother me somewhat that there is essentially only one type of female body. Exaggeration of physical characteristics is one thing; complete distortion of the human form is another. I also think that the over-muscled men in comics are absolutely grotesque.

The thing that probably bothers me the most is that the distortion of the masculine form is to make then more "manly" or "capable" whereas the way that women are emphasised does nothing except sexualize them.

If you've never run across it, Women in Refrigerators is an interesting read. So are some of the responses from male creators.

Webcomics: for some reason these don't bother me much. Occasionally I'll have a

moment where I go "What the Hell???" but that usually fades after a few minutes. This might be because every comic with big boobies I read online has a certain comedic element which I don't run into often in print comics.

Occasionally there are exceptions to my not being bothered by webcomics. There's been some discussion recently in Comic Pitching and the TT&T forums about the extremely oversized boob in one comic. I wouldn't really care that much but every time I look at a strip I expect the female in question to tip over and that definitely lowers the readability for me.

I'm also a lot less irritated if them thingies look more like mammaries as opposed to water balloons.

As I said earlier, all of my answers would have been different if I was still in my pubescent years. If one's target audience includes people still in their formative years (physically and mentally) one should probably keep in mind how impressionable they can be and how misportrayals could affect them. I think it matters less if you're catering to mature teens or adults.

...I have no idea if i managed to say all of that in a way that makes sense.

Blackaby · Post by **Blackaby** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:28 am

ryclaude wrote:All the guys in the comic will now have exaggerated crotch bulges.

HELLO GOD!!!!!

Noise Monkey · Post by **Noise Monkey** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:29 am

We all have to have some thick skin around here, so if Josie isn't cool with people disagreeing (even on a sensitive topic) now might be a good time to withdraw from the conversation (like Remus did yesterday in a different thread, though for different reasons). Otherwise, its pretty well understood that what goes on in a discussion thread, no matter how heated, it stays there. When he first appeared, I disagreed rather harshly with one of Teammayhem's reviews and I said so. Since then, we've gotten on nicely. I don't hold his view of the comic (Mr. Bob's Star Bored, I think it was) against him and I hope he doesn't hold my comments against me.

Pillywiggin · Post by **Pillywiggin** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:41 am

wishmaster wrote:
Rocknjosie wrote:
helixdq wrote:Well for the record i usually enjoy being "objectified" and i'm sure a lot of people do. Or they wouldn't work so much on their image, they wouldn't dress the way they do, talk, gesture the way they do.
It really makes me sad that you wrote that. The self hate you describe right there is exactly what bothers me.
I didn't read anywhere in helixdq's response where they hated themself. Are you sure it's not your self-hate we're dealing with here? That's what I have to wonder when someone hectors other people like this.

Eh. While I don't think that I saw anything remotely resembling "self-hate" in helixdq's original post, I can see why Rocknjosie overreacted. The "If you don't want men slobering over you, then you should dress in a burlap sack" argument is offensive and has actually been said to me.

If I want to dress nicely it is because I feel like it, not because I want to tittillate people. If you want to lust over me fine, but stop blaming me for your carnal desires.

(please note that the "you" in the previous sentence is a abstarct generallity and is not aimed at a particular person or even a particular gender)

RemusShepherd · Post by **RemusShepherd** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 8:51 am

ryclaude wrote:You know what I'm gonna do?
All the guys in the comic will now have exaggerated crotch bulges.

You know, I've been working on crotch bulges. It's a fine line between 'that's a woman in drag' and 'oh my god is he packing sofa cushions in there?' I still haven't found my happy masculine medium. I need crotch bulge tips.

As for women, I only have three in my story, only 2 of which have appeared so far. One is supposed to be a sexpot, so I'll draw her that way. Another one is sixty years old and *dead*, so she won't be objectifying women much. (She does have a wasp-like waist, but that's because her abdominal cavity is largely empty.

)

Noise Monkey · Post by **Noise Monkey** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 9:07 am

so Dr. Laskins won't be showing up in the next bikini thread? aw..

Rocknjosie · Post by **Rocknjosie** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 9:11 am

I'm sorry if I stepped over the line getting so passionate about this. I'm new to the boards, just trying to find my voice. It is a sensitive issue, but in no way am I advocating sensorship. It just felt like for every time I said we should push possitive body images...it doesn't matter, I'm dropping it.

Yeahduff · Post by **Yeahduff** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 9:59 am

ryclaude wrote:You know what I'm gonna do?

All the guys in the comic will now have exaggerated crotch bulges.
Furthermore, Chest puppies is a great term.

I am RYClaude and that was my response *bows*

Yeah. That would iritate the HELL out of me.

Breasts exist. Sometimes they are rather large. More often they are not. And there are some beautiful women out there. But not everyone is a model. It's natural for us to draw what we find attractive, what we want to look at. But we let ourselves of too easy if we just say "I'm just drawing what I want." I don't think Marvel proportions increase the incidence of rape (rape is a crime of violence, satiating power not lust), but looking at nothing but redheaded giraffes with giant boobs gets boring. Don't be so harsh on Josie. She's looking for something she doesn't often find out there, and I'm sure it's frustrating.

On a mod note, we're all getting into the habit of ganging up on new board members. You don't have to like everyone who walks in here, but we don't have to form a posse everytime someone says something offensive.

TheSuburbanLetdown · Post by **TheSuburbanLetdown** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 10:05 am

One of my readers "accused" me of giving my main character a "massive package." He was super-deighted actually. I didn't do it on purpose though, and still don't think it was that huge.

CJBurgandy · Post by **CJBurgandy** » Fri Oct 07, 2005 10:06 am

blackaby wrote:
ryclaude wrote:All the guys in the comic will now have exaggerated crotch bulges.
HELLO GOD!!!!!

That is one Giant Salami