Keenspot - Keenspace?: Relations?

Zuri · Post by **Zuri** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:04 pm

Ghastly wrote:Providing Keenswag to artists at wholesale prices to sell at conventions is a pretty good idea. Unfortunately there are a lot of Keenspot artists who want absolutely nothing to do with Keenspace at all (some going so far as to not want Space to be part of the Keen family) and they'd probably object to their merchandise being sold by lowly Spacers.

*Snorts* Thats pretty.. *rolls eyes * I don't even have words for how stupid that sounds. Not that keenspace is much of 'family' with keenspot in terms beyond they share a name and management group. Space is kind of like that black sheep cousin no one wants to acknowlege regardless of how cool they might be. They are tolerated because they are family but undesirable because of 'status' which I think is a crock of shit.

If they wanted to make a profit from it, it couldn't be 'rock bottom' prices, but the idea that they are providing the information to have merchandise made and perhaps get a commission for the referal or whatever would be a good idea. It would be nice if there were some kind of promotional tools avaliable to keenspacers through keenspot. Even if we had to pay for them, it would be nice to deal with one company rather than several. Keenspot provides a lot of promotion for its comics, it would be nice to see some form of internal advertising for keenspace. Like.. if I wanted to buy ad space on just 'space ( not spot ). I've not seen any info on that anywhere. I was also parusing the keenspot site and noticed this:

Keenspace also includes optional benefits, such as providing forums for the artists, as well as newsboxes and banner programs to help cross-promote. How much does it all cost? Exactly zero dollars and zero cents. ...But you do have to put an ad banner at the tops of your pages.

They might want to change that to read:

Keenspace also includes optional benefits, such as a newsbox and guide to help cross-promote. How much does it all cost? Exactly zero dollars and zero cents. ...But you do have to put an ad banner at the tops of your pages.

Kinda false advertising. newsboxes? I wasn't aware there was more than one. Banner program*s* - we have ONE? and didn't they stop forum signups AGES ago?

Ghastly · Post by **Ghastly** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:05 pm

orion wrote:Why is she so nice to us? From what I understand she has no comic beyond the fanart page (which for some reason I am forbidden from seeing) so why is she so loyal to Keenspace? I seem to recall someone saying she works for free too.

we don't deserve her and her undead powers of sweetness.

I assume her loyality stems from her love of comics.

She may be the most devoted fan we all have.

RPin · Post by **RPin** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:11 pm

Zuri wrote:Not that keenspace is much of 'family' with keenspot in terms beyond they share a name and management group. Space is kind of like that black sheep cousin no one wants to acknowlege regardless of how cool they might be. They are tolerated because they are family but undesirable because of 'status' which I think is a crock of shit.

T Campbell already pointed us as the "embarassing thanksgiving relatives" in his article at Comixpedia.

Ghastly · Post by **Ghastly** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 8:14 pm

Reminds me of a song I wrote called "Drunk Uncle Charlie".

Faub · Post by **Faub** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 8:28 pm

T. Campbell's Comixpedia post for those who haven't seen it. The thanksgiving comment is in the red box.

Warren · Post by **Warren** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 8:37 pm

I don't interpret that as T. Campbell talking smack on us as 'Spacers, but on the structure of the 'Space proper. We're just the latchkey children here. It's not our fault, and I don't think we're being faulted.

Of course, everyone should read the box for themselves.

Post by **Kisai** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 9:43 pm

Ghastly wrote:
orion wrote:Why is she so nice to us? From what I understand she has no comic beyond the fanart page (which for some reason I am forbidden from seeing) so why is she so loyal to Keenspace? I seem to recall someone saying she works for free too.

we don't deserve her and her undead powers of sweetness.
I assume her loyality stems from her love of comics.

She may be the most devoted fan we all have.

I'm still around because I want to be, that and I haven't been hit by a car, commited to an asylum, or gone comatose yet.

If you all knew the kind of stress, depression and general "I hate my life and I want to die" attitude I was holding real life, you'd wonder. Not much has changed, but real life doesn't seem to be going anywhere fast.

(Just the last two weeks I've had all my account information at work deleted, fun fun fun, email doesn't work, it is impossible to get any work done if you are missing one of those logins.)

I'd love to have a 40,000$/yr job doing Keenspace stuff... anyone want to donate that? I will take the entire year off and work on just keenspace.

No? Darn it.

I'm probably no more good at server administration than Piro is at drawing manga, yet we obviously are doing something right or we wouldn't still be doing it right?

I designed an incredably complex modular DB backend for KeenSPACE and had the first design basically given "too complicated" , yet that design didn't get used and a MORE complex version that I had been using the entire time for "The Guide" wound being the backend. Everything I programmed in Perl, runs without errors or warnings in strict mode. I follow coding designs that I didn't learn from anyone. When I discover a faster way of doing something, I use it. This is why guide now updates every hour instead of once a day.

I know what I'm doing, even though I've never taken computer science and have no "pieces of paper" warantee'ing that.

Hence why I work at a 11$/hr job... nobody believe that I know what I'm doing.

Joel Fagin · Post by **Joel Fagin** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 10:55 pm

Kisai wrote:I know what I'm doing, even though I've never taken computer science and have no "pieces of paper" warantee'ing that.

Hence why I work at a 11$/hr job... nobody believe that I know what I'm doing.

Peh. I'm completely untrained in most of what I do for a living. You just have to phrase your resume right - say what you can do rather than what bits of paper you have.

- Joel Fagin

Faub · Post by **Faub** » Thu Apr 29, 2004 11:07 pm

It's really too bad that nobody really cares what you know. For example, I'm a reasonably competent C programmer in practice but I can't put that on my resume because I don't have any work experience with it. As far as that goes, I've had close to 5 years experience with Visual FoxPro and about 6 months experience with Java. I will never been capable of any job more difficult than report writing.

Joel Fagin · Post by **Joel Fagin** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 12:00 am

faub wrote:I'm a reasonably competent C programmer in practice but I can't put that on my resume because I don't have any work experience with it.

Joel Fagin wrote:You just have to phrase your resume right - say what you can do rather than what bits of paper you have.

My resume has "demonstrated skills and abilities" and "achievements"* most prominently placed. I also have my qualifications but only right at the end. Employers say they prefer resumes that state qualifications but they actually tend to hire those who state what they are capable of doing. It's more specific.

It's also great if you have some sort of folio to prove you can do what you claim when you get to the interview.

- Joel Fagin

* Achievments are fantastic things to put on resumes - even webcomics! Show you can keep to a deadline. Well, as far as they know, anyway.

McDuffies · Post by **McDuffies** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 2:45 am

Irony rules the world. In no more that a year, I'll be an engineer, and I know fuckin' nothing. I don't know 5% of what Kisai or Faub know. Though, you shouldn't envy me, I spent hard years learning that nothing. Quite a thing to make you bitter, when after all those years of slaving over the book, I get a part of the project in my hands and I don't even know where to start.

Terotrous · Post by **Terotrous** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 6:45 am

mcDuffies wrote:Irony rules the world. In no more that a year, I'll be an engineer, and I know fuckin' nothing. I don't know 5% of what Kisai or Faub know. Though, you shouldn't envy me, I spent hard years learning that nothing. Quite a thing to make you bitter, when after all those years of slaving over the book, I get a part of the project in my hands and I don't even know where to start.

I maintain that college is causing me to learn less than I would on my own. But it's all to get the piece of paper, right?

War · Post by **War** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 7:10 am

Do you know what's even funnier? In 10 years time, you lot could be entrusting your lives to something I created.

HAHAHA!!!!

Mr.Bob · Post by **Mr.Bob** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 7:26 am

You don't scare me! I've been on British Rail!

Ghastly · Post by **Ghastly** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 7:49 am

Poor Kisai, you were born too late.

Back in the early 80s when I was in highschool and personal computers were such a new and wonderful thing there were companies coming to our highschools to recruit computer geeks into high paying jobs. I had been offered a chance by a friend to move with him to Toronto to take this job at a software company but I turned it down. I wanted to stay in school, graduate, go to college, do all those things you're supposed to do. My friend, well he went on to become a multi-millioneir software developer.

Bitter? Regret? Nope.

I could have moved to Toronto with him and become a software millioneir too. If I had done that then my life would have taken a different path than what it's taken now.

As long as you're happy where you are right now, or happy with where you appear to be going then there's really no place for regret in your life. Your life is a big web of seemingly random interconnected events that branch out and intersect one another. Every turn you take, every path you follow leads you to a different destination than the others. Had I taken that path in highschool then I'd probably be a millioneir partner in a software company too. I'd probably be rich and secure with a nice house and a nice car. But I wouldn't have met many of the friends I now have. I wouldn't have met my wife. I wouldn't have the two kids I have. I wouldn't be playing accordion for a living (which I absolutely love 100 billion times more than programing computers). I wouldn't be doing Ghastly's Ghastly Comic (which like playing accordion for a living I love doing far much more than programming).

My life, despite some really rough and dark times in the past, is really freaking awsome. I may not be a millioneir but what I lack in matterial wealth I more than make up for with the wealth of love, friendship, wisdom, family, creative fulfillment, all the things that really matter. Besides, who is to say that matterial wealth doesn't await me somewhere further down the path I'm walking now? (Hell I've already made a proposal to Chris Crosby to start generating some cash for both Keenspace and myself with my site during this period of no-ads, although he still hasn't gotten back to me with wether or not he wants to take part in it).

Look at my brother. He went from wage-slave security guard to internet tycoon in just a few short years. Most of his 30-some years were spent hand-to-mouth and now he's making, well, let me put it to you this way, if I could make a dollar for every pageview my webcomic gets in a month, I'd come pretty close to making as much money as my little brother makes in a month. Pretty fricken sweet, eh? So you never know what the future holds for you.

So don't get too down right now Kisai. You're bright and you're young. You've still got a lot of path walking ahead of you.

JJcareksims · Post by **JJcareksims** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:01 am

I came back after a year off Keenspace....Keenspace is actually BETTER than it was it was before! The whole set up process was faster, cleaner, and no hassles! Anyone with a brain can set up a KS account faster!

You do a lot Kisai and I am grateful.

TheGoobla · Post by **TheGoobla** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:29 am

Ghastly wrote:I wouldn't be doing Ghastly's Ghastly Comic

And if you hadn't been doing GGC, I never would have become as involved with KeenSpace as I am--in fact I'd go so far as to say I would never have become interesting webcartooning or the entire community in the first place!

And I love you all so much! What would I ever do without all of you?

* Huggles Ghastly *

THANK YOU SO MUCH GHASTLY!

* Puts on frilly French maid outfit *

^_^

Ghastly · Post by **Ghastly** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:43 am

TheGoobla wrote: * Huggles Ghastly *

THANK YOU SO MUCH GHASTLY!

* Puts on frilly French maid outfit *

^_^

Woohoo! Just in time for the last day of April too and me hankering for some spankering.

You're most definetly welcome.

Nyke · Post by **Nyke** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:50 am

JJcareksims wrote:I came back after a year off Keenspace....Keenspace is actually BETTER than it was it was before! The whole set up process was faster, cleaner, and no hassles! Anyone with a brain can set up a KS account faster!

You do a lot Kisai and I am grateful.

OOooh, JJ.
*takes picture of JJcareksims*
This has to be worth thousands.

Warren · Post by **Warren** » Fri Apr 30, 2004 11:56 am

DarkMagician wrote:
JJcareksims wrote:I came back after a year off Keenspace....Keenspace is actually BETTER than it was it was before! The whole set up process was faster, cleaner, and no hassles! Anyone with a brain can set up a KS account faster!

You do a lot Kisai and I am grateful.
OOooh, JJ.
*takes picture of JJcareksims*
This has to be worth thousands.

I'd think Goobla's picture would be worth more. Unless he ALWAYS wears a French Maid's outfit. Which is likely.