WHEEEEE!!

Gwalla · Post by **Gwalla** » Wed Jan 10, 2001 9:49 am

Oh, and look for European papers. They tend to take comics a little more seriously. See if Jean "Moebius" Giraud has written any essays or papers.------------------
"Truth hides on the other side of a two-way mirror
In countless documents sent straight to the shredder
That might finally give us the whole of the picture
But until the day we decide to dig a little deeper
We know that truth will hide
Under fallen rocks and stones
At the end of a disconnected phone
Down an unmarked street
And buried, deep beneath your feet."
- Asian Dub Foundation, "Truth Hides" from Community Music

Glych · Post by **Glych** » Wed Jan 10, 2001 10:33 am

I wrote an essay on why Batman was better than Superman. And backed it up..b.lah blahblah....it won me a nation scholarship and helped me into college....Besides Scott McCloud, I would also recommend Watchmen, because it is considered one of the top peices of literature in the 20th century and did win a Hugo. (sci-fi? what are they thinking!?!?!)Anyhoo, also talk about the big hubbub over the death of superman...That "affected' people.The fact that people can tell you Spiderman's motto (With great power also comes great responsibility) and how he got it(the death of his uncle Ben) but cannot tell you all of Shakespeare's plays...Speaking of the shake-a-speare man, in old england, people didn't consider his plays to be "literature" because they were written in English, not latic, and cared for deeply by the people. They were entertainment. Perhaps Comics are the next Shakespeare...HHHmmm???woah...too deep for this So'Cal chick...must go sleep now...yess....-glych------------------
-glych <A HREF="http://glych.keenspace.com" TARGET=_blank>http://glych.keenspace.com</A> No Stereotypes, what? Are you afraid you might like it?

Damonk13 · Post by **Damonk13** » Wed Jan 10, 2001 12:16 pm

...I'm taking a short break on this bibliography that I'm amassing at the moment -- and it's all about COMIC BOOKS, baby!! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">One of the ideas I'm toying with for my Ph. D. Thesis is to argue the validity of the Comic Book/Strip genres as acceptable LITERATURE!While the Art world has been making great strides in the last decade or two in the ackloledgement of Comics as ART, little has been done to promote it as Lit.Scott McCloud (the gods bless him!) has touched upon it in his second book, and there are some fairly notable authors/critics who have dealt with it (Umberto Eco has done some pretty good stuff!), but it has yet to be given the attention it deserves...So! Here's little ole' me thinking about it!Hey! If any of you know of any good articles/papers/books that have been written about the subject, feel free to point them out to me! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">(and now... to enjoy this little break by responding to more message board stuff!) <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/eek.gif">

Gwalla · Post by **Gwalla** » Wed Jan 10, 2001 12:51 pm

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by damonk13:
One of the ideas I'm toying with for my Ph. D. Thesis is to argue the validity of the Comic Book/Strip genres as acceptable LITERATURE!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Sounds like a good idea to me! <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>While the Art world has been making great strides in the last decade or two in the ackloledgement of Comics as ART, little has been done to promote it as Lit.Scott McCloud (the gods bless him!) has touched upon it in his second book, and there are some fairly notable authors/critics who have dealt with it (Umberto Eco has done some pretty good stuff!), but it has yet to be given the attention it deserves...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>*chants* E-CO! E-CO! E-CO!Foucault's Pendulum fan right here! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif"> <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Hey! If any of you know of any good articles/papers/books that have been written about the subject, feel free to point them out to me! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin ... P>Hrmm...I don't know of that many books/papers/etc. about it. Other than "Understanding Comics" and "Reinventing Comics" (the former more than the latter) by Scott McCloud, and "Comics and Sequential Art" and "Graphic Storytelling" by Will Eisner (the latter is less well-known than the former, but equally worthy). Also, "Manga Manga! The World of Japanese Comics" and "Dreamland Japan" by Frederick L. Schodt for an international flavor. Dreamland Japan in particular has info on a lot of avant-garde manga artists, many of whom take a more literary approach.It's not a field that's been heavily investigated. Consider yourself a trailblazer! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">As far as examples go, Watchmen and Maus must be mentioned. Hmm...Sandman would probably be good too. Black and White (a manga, but certainly not your typical manga) would make a great example--it's sort of a surreal allegory. "Nausic

Sir Forsyth · Post by **Sir Forsyth** » Thu Jan 11, 2001 3:16 am

hmmm...are you going to discuss webcomics too?

Damonk13 · Post by **Damonk13** » Thu Jan 11, 2001 7:02 am

Whew!Well, the bibliography is done, and thanks for your suggestions!I had most of what you suggested already listed (with the exception of Schodt, which I had forgotten~~ thanks, Gwalla!), but having you name them just reinforced the idea in my head that the selections I have made so far are good ones...Man... I sure hope that I can pull this off when the time comes (I don't start my Ph.D. for another two years!)...Anywho, thanks again, gwalla, glych, and SirF! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">

Sir Forsyth · Post by **Sir Forsyth** » Fri Jan 12, 2001 3:38 am

but i didn't do anything...

U2QueenBee · Post by **U2QueenBee** » Fri Jan 12, 2001 4:42 am

Ok, it's official...It was already starting in the Blotto Forum, and with the cute comic persona, and the hair...and the Pinky and Brain reference...and now a thesis on comics? Damonk, I think I'm in love with you! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif"> <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">Zut alors! I seriously considered doing my masters dissertation (in Art History) on animation...despite any strides in the field though, you'd be surprised how reactionary and stuffy most art academics are. "Yes master...I will be your clone...I will do whatever you say..." Professor: "Brilliant! You show great insight and creative thinking! Well done!" Damn I hate the educational establishment elite, bunch of pompous stuffed-shirt know-it-alls in their big ugly imitation ivory towers sneering down on the rest of humanity...grr...oh, there are still people here..heh.Anyway I think it's a great idea and if you need a researcher for the art angle I'd be happy to help out...I have a really bad feeling my dissertation (on images of women in art nouveau jewellery in Britain and France...zzzz) didn't pass anyway, I'm just too American (and not boring and long-winded enough, if you can believe that) for the people in Scotland, I think. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/frown.gif"> <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/frown.gif"> <insert crying disappointed face here>Near as I can tell it all comes down to how much a** you kiss anyway.But I'm being cynical again, I'll shut up now.Queen Bee "What issues????"

Lostfactor · Post by **Lostfactor** » Fri Jan 12, 2001 6:58 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by Sir Forsyth:
but i didn't do anything...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Shhh! Just smile and take the credit. With any luck you can use it to milk him later when he's rich.
-Eliot "...and you can't even let go of the PS2 controller to get away from me!" Lefebvre------------------
<A HREF="http://www.crosswinds.net/~lostfactor" TARGET=_blank>Electronic Transcendence Productions</A>
And if that one doesn't work, try the <A HREF="http://members.fortunecity.com/lostfactor" TARGET=_blank>mirror site.</A>

Damonk13 · Post by **Damonk13** » Sun Jan 14, 2001 5:02 am

where are you attending, exactly?thing is, most "big name" schools are going to fall flat on their faces in terms of their humanities departments if they don't open themselves up to what's going on out there...the future is multimedia, and the acdemics have to start looking at how these new media and the combinations therof are going to have a profound and lasting effect on the arts scene...

Gwalla · Post by **Gwalla** » Sun Jan 14, 2001 10:19 am

Damonk, you might want to check out "Strip Mind" by George Saunders, in the January 7, 2001 issue of the New York Times Magazine. It's an obituary of Charles Schulz, and it's not very long, but it may be useful.Oh, and don't forget to brush up on your Marshall MacLuhan!------------------
"Truth hides on the other side of a two-way mirror
In countless documents sent straight to the shredder
That might finally give us the whole of the picture
But until the day we decide to dig a little deeper
We know that truth will hide
Under fallen rocks and stones
At the end of a disconnected phone
Down an unmarked street
And buried, deep beneath your feet."
- Asian Dub Foundation, "Truth Hides" from Community Music

Damonk13 · Post by **Damonk13** » Sun Jan 14, 2001 10:36 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by gwalla:
Oh, and don't forget to brush up on your Marshall MacLuhan!
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>You can bet that Marshall will be used n my argument, as well as some Bakhtinian thoery, and other postmodern ideas that apply...however, i don't want this to hinge entirely on postmodern edicts, especially since postmodernism is already becoming dated...of course, good ole' mrshall transcends postmoderism anywho, so there'lll be no probs there! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">Oh, and thanks again, gwalla! every little ebit is a BIG help!! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/cool.gif">

U2QueenBee · Post by **U2QueenBee** » Mon Jan 15, 2001 3:51 am

University of St. Andrews...well, actually I'm all finished now, just waiting nervously for Feb. 9th when the examination committee will be finished marking dissertations, and I find out for sure that I'm a miserable hopeless failure who will never work in a museum. But hey, I've got a lovely budding career as a health insurance underwriting clerk...nevermind the fact that I'll be moving to a country with nationalised health care soon. *sigh*I miss my Dave. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/frown.gif"> But he's coming on Friday, yay!

Gwalla · Post by **Gwalla** » Mon Jan 15, 2001 12:48 pm

Just found out that <A HREF="http://www.commonreader.com/" TARGET=_blank>A Common Reader</A> is now offering a <A HREF="http://www.commonreader.com/cgi-bin/rbox/ido.cgi?5920" TARGET=_blank>book collection of Rube Goldberg's cartoons</A>, which might be useful in showing how you can "read" a picture.------------------
"Truth hides on the other side of a two-way mirror
In countless documents sent straight to the shredder
That might finally give us the whole of the picture
But until the day we decide to dig a little deeper
We know that truth will hide
Under fallen rocks and stones
At the end of a disconnected phone
Down an unmarked street
And buried, deep beneath your feet."
- Asian Dub Foundation, "Truth Hides" from Community Music

Gwalla · Post by **Gwalla** » Tue Jan 16, 2001 4:12 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by damonk13:
gwalla: when i take over the world, I think I'm going to make you my Minister of Intelligence...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">------------------
"Truth hides on the other side of a two-way mirror
In countless documents sent straight to the shredder
That might finally give us the whole of the picture
But until the day we decide to dig a little deeper
We know that truth will hide
Under fallen rocks and stones
At the end of a disconnected phone
Down an unmarked street
And buried, deep beneath your feet."
- Asian Dub Foundation, "Truth Hides" from Community Music

Damonk13 · Post by **Damonk13** » Tue Jan 16, 2001 8:29 am

heh... don't be so hard on yourself, QueenBee~~ I'm sure that you did fine! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">gwalla: when i take over the world, I think I'm going to make you my Minister of Intelligence...

Maboo · Post by **Maboo** » Wed Jan 17, 2001 1:31 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by damonk13:
heh... don't be so hard on yourself, QueenBee~~ I'm sure that you did fine! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif">
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>
Of course she did, she's my friend. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">Mab
------------------
<A HREF="http://blottostreet.keenspace.com" TARGET=_blank>Blotto Street</A> - The most important British webcomic about student life you'll EVER read.

U2QueenBee · Post by **U2QueenBee** » Wed Jan 17, 2001 2:08 am

Aww thanks guys *hugs*...I guess I'm just having a bad stress week!*chants* BLOT-TO BLOT-TO, FRA-MED FRA-MED!!Must go rest head now...yes....

Reinder · Post by **Reinder** » Wed Jan 17, 2001 5:12 am

Why not talk about music's validity as sculpture? I thought McCloud's idea was that comics were comics (OK: "Sequential art") and didn't need to be anything else.------------------
Reinder Dijkhuis
<A HREF="http://www.rocr.net/" TARGET=_blank>Rogues of Clwyd-Rhan</A>, Humorous fantasy strip, updated Mon-Fri, and really rather good. <A HREF="http://www.rocr.net/d/20000701.html" TARGET=_blank>Read it from the first strip!</A>

Damonk13 · Post by **Damonk13** » Wed Jan 17, 2001 9:24 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by reinder:
Why not talk about music's validity as sculpture? I thought McCloud's idea was that comics were comics (OK: "Sequential art") and didn't need to be anything else.
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>i am determined to bring valid comic book literature out of its falsified "funny papers" shell...Hey, man -- I'm an English major! it's what i do! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/biggrin.gif"> and just because i like a lot of what mccloud says does not mean that i should be his clone! <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/eek.gif">frankly, reinder, i don't see what is wrong with my plan. but feel free to counterargue ~~ i am notr afraid to discuss this to any lengths... <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">