Trying too hard? Or hiding too hard?

Jackalope · Post by **Jackalope** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:08 am

squidflakes wrote:
Honor wrote:and less tolerance for music that sounds like cutting aluminum cans with a chainsaw.

Oh come on, Einsturzende neubauten kicks ass!

That's industrial, not goth.
(hey, if we're going to be snarky)

My experience with the punk, death rocker and later new romantic and goth movements was that they all had a fucking sense of humor. Saturday Night Live's "Goth Talk" sketches were great. They actually caught more of the spirit of the original goth scene than many of the clubs I've been into the last several years. Though for a while someone had a beautiful page up on goth dancing that included descriptions of "washing windows," "picking apples," and "looking for my contact lens." And the old standby "the back of my hand is stapled to my forehead, the angst, the angst!"

Anyone who hasn't read the comic book Gloom Cookie needs to go find the trade paperbacks. The artists are locals and um...I have a pretty damn good idea who some of their inspirations were (bwahahaha). I dunno if it qualifies as "true goth," but I'm pretty sure that "fake goth" includes taking all that angst shit way too seriously.

Baron Samedi and Papa Gede are the biggest, crudest pranksters out there...

Lulujayne · Post by **Lulujayne** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:41 pm

Why do I know that name vaguely - Baron Samedi?

Tellner · Post by **Tellner** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:20 pm

Lulujayne wrote:Why do I know that name vaguely - Baron Samedi?

Lord of graveyards, the Voudun loa of death.

Squidflakes · Post by **Squidflakes** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 1:47 pm

Lulujayne wrote:Why do I know that name vaguely - Baron Samedi?

What Tellner said, but also overused in the goth community, role-playing community, and pretty much any community where the name Nemesis is considered proper.

Error of Logic · Post by **Error of Logic** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:00 pm

He probably became popular in Western circles because of a fake Samedi's appearance in that one James Bond movie, I forget the title. Was it 'Live and let die'?

Scarecrow · Post by **Scarecrow** » Wed Nov 02, 2005 10:17 pm

Error of Logic wrote:He probably became popular in Western circles because of a fake Samedi's appearance in that one James Bond movie, I forget the title. Was it 'Live and let die'?

Yep. And a random tidbit: the Beatles did the theme song for that particular one.

Jackalope · Post by **Jackalope** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 12:05 am

Yup. The Baron is head of all the Gedes (there are loads of them, and more pop up all the time). His wife is Mamman Brigette, who is syncreticized with St.Brigid. When you enter the graveyard after dark, you knock and ask the Baron's permission first. And if you take anything (dirt, rocks, plants), you leave a money offering. How much that offering is depends on where you're from and who taught you. Three pennies is the most common amount. It's also common to take a sampler-sized bottle of whisky along and pour it out as an offering.

The Gedes are...well, they're more than just spirits of the dead. It's a social pressure valve. The Gedes can pretty much say and do anything they feel like without reprocussions because they're dead, after all. "If you're full of shit, Papa Gede will make you wear it." In some ways, they're like the Hopi clowns who will pick the most pompous individual in town and follow him/her around making fun of them. The Gedes are all about sex and the regeneration of life as well as death, which makes a sort of sense if you live in a society without much medicine and horrible conditions. So the Baron and all his family are rude, crude and obnoxious pranksters. And if you get offended, they'll bother you more. If you have a "MESS WITH ME" sign flashing over your head, they will oblige.

This makes Fete Gede an...entertaining holiday. Picture folks possessed by Gede wandering around, making fun of every political and religious power out there. One of the funnier ones I heard about was the guy dressed in a little dress, pillbox hat and prim little heels, carrying a clutch purse and a bible under one arm. Yes, Missionary Church Lady! Leading a whole choir of young men in obscene hymns. I'm sure there's a Gede who makes fun of George W. Bush, too, somewhere.

(Seems appropriate to discuss this, since 1 Nov is All Saints Day, the last day of Fete Gede)

But I always get a giggle at the baby bats and the pretentious goths who take everything so seriously. Even the "scary" archetypes they draw on have prankster elements that they're ignoring.

Lulujayne · Post by **Lulujayne** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 7:20 am

Ahh, thanks - I've always wondered about voodoo. It's not big in the Land of Oz as I'm sure you can imagine.

I think I heard his name pop up in some old White Zombie song too....

*ducks out of range from the pelting stones*

Squidflakes · Post by **Squidflakes** » Thu Nov 03, 2005 9:17 am

Rob Zombie is definately a big fan of the Voodoo.

That reminds me, Hoodoo and Voodoo are great computer repair tools. Nothing gets duppies out of your machines faster than invoking Legba.

Pictured below is my gris-gris computer repair stick

I've since added a RAID array.

Jackalope · Post by **Jackalope** » Fri Nov 04, 2005 1:32 am

Heh. Works at least as well as threatening the wretched things. I used to take the tool box out and set it on the desk next to the computer. Problem usually resolved itself pretty damn quickly. Though my purple G3 iMac was either masochistic or retarded--I had to crack the case on that thing more times to retrieve stuck CDs. Gah, I hated those slot drives.

But that's what my fabulously carved gimp stick is for, right? Not only does it look impressive, but I can whack the shit out of things with it...

Squidflakes · Post by **Squidflakes** » Fri Nov 04, 2005 7:46 am

Not being a gimp stick weilder, I find that something with shiney bits, loud clacking metal things, and lots and lots of copper wire (to dampen the Voodoo fields and amplify the Hoodoo fields, of course) does a lot more good.

Course, in the early days of the stick there was some backfire. Some monitor destroying backfire.

Error of Logic · Post by **Error of Logic** » Fri Nov 04, 2005 8:15 am

Heh, that reminds me of a *Helpdesk* (tm) story which culminated in this moment. It starts here, for reference.

Kenryoku · Post by **Kenryoku** » Fri Nov 04, 2005 9:34 pm

Not reading the entire thread just commenting on the first, but ...

... Pussycat Dolls and Mariah Carey ? Definately selling their sex in a blantent move to cover up a painful lack of genuine talent in their cases (though I am a picky individual at times with music so YMMV, I cant stand their asses). Yuck to the lot of those two names.

Error of Logic · Post by **Error of Logic** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:22 am

squidflakes wrote:
tellner wrote:
squidflakes wrote:
Moderation is for monks!
"If it causes you to stumble,
If it causes you to fall,
Too much fun just ain't no fun at all."
"Its better to regret the things you have done, than to regret the things you haven't done."

Than what if you find yourself with your parents' blood on your hands and their corpses at your feet because you finally allowed yourself to 'let go', when they'd gotten under your skin one time too many? <_<

Swordsman3003 · Post by **Swordsman3003** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 10:36 am

<_<

>_>

This thread escaped my comprehension when it turned to gothic...stuff.

(A word to hentaicat: I would be perfect for you too....if you could find it in yourself to date a guy....who may not even be gay or bi....

Squidflakes · Post by **Squidflakes** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 11:33 am

Error of Logic wrote:
squidflakes wrote:
tellner wrote: "If it causes you to stumble,
If it causes you to fall,
Too much fun just ain't no fun at all."
"Its better to regret the things you have done, than to regret the things you haven't done."
Than what if you find yourself with your parents' blood on your hands and their corpses at your feet because you finally allowed yourself to 'let go', when they'd gotten under your skin one time too many? <_<

Then you claim years of systematic abuse and make millions on a book deal.

And jeez EoL, its just a saying.

Moo Cow · Post by **Moo Cow** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:34 pm

swordsman3003 wrote:(A word to hentaicat: I would be perfect for you too....if you could find it in yourself to date a guy....who may not even be gay or bi....

Wow, i was thinking the same thing..... haha that's so sad.

It's just you guys are similar! You can at least be buddies....

heh

~Sara

HentaiCat · Post by **HentaiCat** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:12 pm

(A word to hentaicat: I would be perfect for you too....if you could find it in yourself to date a guy....who may not even be gay or bi....

Wow, i was thinking the same thing..... haha that's so sad.

It's just you guys are similar! You can at least be buddies....

heh

~Sara

Ya

Swordsman3003 · Post by **Swordsman3003** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:04 pm

Well, that suits me fine. I will buy you a beer when we are 21.

Honor · Post by **Honor** » Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:05 pm

HentaiCat wrote:
(A word to hentaicat: I would be perfect for you too....if you could find it in yourself to date a guy....who may not even be gay or bi....

Wow, i was thinking the same thing..... haha that's so sad.

It's just you guys are similar! You can at least be buddies....

heh

~Sara
Ya