Critique - More new pics

Jackhass · Post by **Jackhass** » Thu May 05, 2005 11:11 pm

"Something just occured to me.... why DO I draw pictures of half naked girls??"

OH EM GEE! RU A LEZBEUN?!?!!!! I kid, I kid...some fairly nice stuff on your website there.

"And twiggy does not equal sexy in my book."

Me either, but I don't like 'em muscular either...soft and maybe even a little plump for me.

Chibiartstudios · Post by **Chibiartstudios** » Fri May 06, 2005 12:13 am

A few notes about the female body!

(From a guy)

OK, I wanted to make a few general pointers that I see missed alot when drawing women. I tried to make the pictures as tame as possible. I should also note that while I agree wiht FAUB in saying that twiggy doesn't always equal hot, these women qualify as both! ^_^ When drawing your character try to make them a little more... realistic.

The first thing I want you to notice is the boobs. Gaze at them. Let them into your subconcious! Let them convince you to buy my prints at my store! Now notice that when in a position where the chest is arching out the breasts flatten out some. It takes a 3/4th view to see them better and in some positions like where the arms are raised they pretty much dissapear. If you are drawing women sprawled out and they still have bulging boobs your woman needs surgery or something. I also feel the need to point out that most pictures you will see of women are at 3/4ths this is the most atractive angle for women in my opinion and you should learn it well seing as you almost never see a straight on in real life.

There are 2 things to be noticed here. First off I want to pount out that there is a myth that the arm contains 2 parts connected by a joint. This is just untrue. There are in actuality 3 (4 if you include the hand). The third is the collar bone which is curved along the neck. You can then connect the shoulder joint with the elbot to the wrist bone in a pair of curves that ALWAYS curve towards eachother slightly.

Second notice the ribcage. It juts out just below the breast. Most beginners forget this and draw some off shaped women.

Again with the arms and ribs. But this time I pointed out the hip. The hip is actually wider than the torso (minus the arms) and it is here that the clothes fall on.

Also notice the breast position. It's a whole head height before the nipple is usually reached. take care to note these as head height is a big indicator of age. You should also take in the fact that at the 3/4ths view you usually end up with one breast pointed at you and the other to the side to where the nipple is almost at a side view. This varies some depending on the angle.

Nipples are typically around 45 degrees from the centerline of the body from the area between the shoulder bones. The main thing I want you to see here though is that at a dead on straight view breasts dont go out the sides naturally. So all those people you see drawing breasts spilling out the sides are drawing wrong. I noticed you had this problem in your first pic big time.

It's also interesting to point out the way the neck connects to the body. This is another area newbs tend to ignore. A good connection to the body will create a more believable form.

(I love my job!)

More arms as you can see. I also want you to see that the back is angled inwards. This is true in men as well. The back is not straight but caves inwards. The belly button is also placed alot higher than most people believe. Theres alot of space there between the belly button and the vagina.

I mainly wanted to point out the backside. Notice the shoulderblades stick out. That's an important feature when drawing women. Learning skelital structure helps place this well.

Also notice the buttock. There are actually 4 spheres in there that overlab some in sort of a butterfly shape. Drawing 4 instead of 2 really helps to create a more believable pelvis. Alot of pictures lack this one.

Mostly something so the ladys don't feel left out. Notice the arm rule still applies along with the nipple rule. There is also a greater dip in the arm mucle space noted. I could to into pages of detail over the differenced between the ideal male and female. But I'm tired. Just know that males are usually better toned while women have a softer look to them. It's why men like them really.

In the future I should probably put my money where my mouth is and cook something up of my own for review. It's high time I see if I can practice what I preach.

Tears · Post by **Tears** » Sat May 07, 2005 7:13 am

chibiartstudios wrote: The main thing I want you to see here though is that at a dead on straight view breasts dont go out the sides naturally. So all those people you see drawing breasts spilling out the sides are drawing wrong.

I don't want to contradict such an expert but the evidence of careful observation and the bathroom mirror suggest differently. Perhaps these artists are not wrong merely using models who are a different shape?

Squeaky · Post by **Squeaky** » Sat May 07, 2005 9:32 am

My mirror disagrees as well. But let's not turn this into another boobie discussion...

Thanks so much for all that stuff!

K I did a pic using reference for the chest.... i was gonna use the face too but it turned out SO different cuz it just din look good so i erased it and drew it my way.

Viola. Manflesh.

Ya I know the arm's fucked up, i tried to fix it but once it was inked and scanned it was a lil too late. I often mess things up in the inking phase and dont have the heart to scrap the drawing.

Chibiartstudios · Post by **Chibiartstudios** » Sat May 07, 2005 10:20 pm

tears wrote:
chibiartstudios wrote: The main thing I want you to see here though is that at a dead on straight view breasts dont go out the sides naturally. So all those people you see drawing breasts spilling out the sides are drawing wrong.
I don't want to contradict such an expert but the evidence of careful observation and the bathroom mirror suggest differently. Perhaps these artists are not wrong merely using models who are a different shape?

You may be right. I am a guy and have little ability to test that theory. But I find that odd seing as I've looked at alot of models in life drawing classes and found that to be true more often than not. And even when it wasn't trie they only extended slightly outwards. In any case. I'll take your experience with breasts over mine on this one.

And nice manpic BTW. My only major criticism is that the hand is a bit aquard. Though hands ARE a pain in the ass.

Good job!

Squeaky · Post by **Squeaky** » Sun May 08, 2005 9:48 pm

DUDE you guys- whoever was interested in that really famous opera singer- I found out more about him today. He used to be a flutist, and then he was shot in the face for trying to save 40 kids from being killed. He saved them, but the wound got gangrenous... (he looks fine to me, btw). So on and so forth but basically when he book comes out, you wont know its him cuz all the names have to be changed and it has to be set in the future because there are people still out to kill him... jewish extremists.

Just... damn his life SUCKS. His daughter, age 22, just died, his mother just died, and the one person hes got left is his ex wifr who refuses to divorce him and takes al his money. He showed me a picture of his daughter the other day and never said anything, I asked who it was cuz she was so pretty but she died in a car accident last year or something.

btw im trying to get my keenspace thing up- I haven't put a link here yet because all i have is the basics so it looks like crap. Plus I need new pages because the first couple i did suck. Yet I spent so many hours on them it would be a waste to redraw them since some parts look good... but i can do better from now on. (First were colored with prismacolor but the next ones will be CG)

-Squeaky

If this was too much random information that you dont care about, I apologize. I'm just like that.

AsterAzul · Post by **AsterAzul** » Mon May 09, 2005 12:31 am

Ooh! You colored something in "like two minutes" and it looks awesome.

*grumble* It takes me like two hours to color something in flat shades...

Wow, you guys are really into this realism thing.
<_<
>_>

I'm just happy when my characters are recognizably human and don't take forever to draw. Took me about two hours to do just a five panel strip... of course I'm struggling with the blocking and scripting right now... why did I choose to rewrite my prologue?

AsterAzul · Post by **AsterAzul** » Mon May 09, 2005 12:36 am

I thought the hands in the pic were pretty good...

Squeaky · Post by **Squeaky** » Mon May 09, 2005 10:07 am

Lol. Well one of the hands I really messed up, and then ended up smudging it all over the place in photoshop trying to fix it... so granted that one looks a little weird but i think overall its not that noticable.

Thanks for the positive comments!

Rkolter · Post by **Rkolter** » Mon May 09, 2005 10:33 am

Squeaky wrote:Lol. Well one of the hands I really messed up, and then ended up smudging it all over the place in photoshop trying to fix it... so granted that one looks a little weird but i think overall its not that noticable.

Thanks for the positive comments!

NICE job. More than I'll ever do.

One question... why is he wearing underwear? You can see it as a waistline above his crotch, like he was wearing underwear, and then put the fish-tail on seperately.

RemusShepherd · Post by **RemusShepherd** » Mon May 09, 2005 10:45 am

chibiartstudios wrote:
tears wrote:
chibiartstudios wrote: The main thing I want you to see here though is that at a dead on straight view breasts dont go out the sides naturally. So all those people you see drawing breasts spilling out the sides are drawing wrong.
I don't want to contradict such an expert but the evidence of careful observation and the bathroom mirror suggest differently. Perhaps these artists are not wrong merely using models who are a different shape?
You may be right. I am a guy and have little ability to test that theory. But I find that odd seing as I've looked at alot of models in life drawing classes and found that to be true more often than not. And even when it wasn't trie they only extended slightly outwards. In any case. I'll take your experience with breasts over mine on this one.

I've found that using a mirror can cause more problems than it solves. Especially if you yourself have odd proportions. After drawing figures based on how I look in the mirror, I'm convinced that I have deformed hands, feet, abdomen, and facial features, and my shoulders are approximately as broad as a New York City bridge. Characters I draw according to my own proportions in a mirror always come out looking like pygmy Frankenstein monsters with mumps.

The fact that in reality I look relatively normal points to the mirror as the culprit, not my body shape nor my artistic skill.

Squeaky · Post by **Squeaky** » Mon May 09, 2005 9:03 pm

He's not wearing underwear! its just a quirk of my merman.... near his waist it gets lighter. If you look theres no line separating his fishtail and that little triangle. It's part of his fishtail. Supposed to look interesting.

Oh well.

Squeaky · Post by **Squeaky** » Wed May 11, 2005 12:54 pm

Just some random stuff... I dunno...
I always update all this shit on my website but these are favs...

Sketch286 · Post by **Sketch286** » Wed May 11, 2005 4:48 pm

you should try experimenting with different body types, it looks like all of your girls are thin and long waisted, so maybe you could try a wider set or more curved every now and then. Variety is a good thing.

KODAMA · Post by **KODAMA** » Wed May 11, 2005 6:00 pm

You need to color with contrast of light and dark.
Give up the airbrush and experiment with solid colors.

Sput · Post by **Sput** » Wed May 11, 2005 6:12 pm

KODAMA wrote:You need to color with contrast of light and dark.
Give up the airbrush and experiment with solid colors.[/u]

or just use more colours? i airbrush a lot, but i use a wide range of colours to get the full contrast i can

i agree, look at some stock photos (i suggest morguefile.com and sxc.hu) just to see other body types. i need to learn how to draw on the plumper side, too, really.

the first one you posted really irritates me because you have an extra light source in his hand but it affects nothing! his robe would be coloured, and it would probably tinge his face!

KODAMA · Post by **KODAMA** » Wed May 11, 2005 6:19 pm

XD yeah, coloring with more colors than blue, off blue, kind of blue, bluish blue, wannabe blue and nearly blue would be useful. I guess what I was trying to say was: try to add in more definite clear shadows. All of the illustrations looked like they were just.. inconfidently airbrushed at the end because the creator couldn't figure out how to shade.
Don't be afraid to use significantly darker colors to shade - it will most likely look nicer than shading with a color that is pretty much identical to your normal color. (as in highlights - normal - shadow)

AsterAzul · Post by **AsterAzul** » Wed May 11, 2005 6:41 pm

I like the colors... maybe she's just trying to set a mood?

KODAMA · Post by **KODAMA** » Wed May 11, 2005 7:03 pm

AsterAzul wrote:I like the colors... maybe she's just trying to set a mood?

The choice of colors is not really a problem - what I'm talking about is coloring (not shading. I really mean coloring) to match the light source. Contrary to popular practice, light things are not merely whiter, and darker things are not simply blacker. A T-shirt outside on a sunny day will usually have sky blue shadows. A black jacket is not completely pitch black when under a spotlight (depending on the color of the spotlight, the jacket can be more like brown or navy)

There needs to be more emphasis on what is actually light and what is actually dark, like the parts near the light source comming out of the girl's hands compare to maybe where the arms would cast a shadow if the light source is not between the body and the arms.

Squeaky · Post by **Squeaky** » Thu May 12, 2005 9:51 am

Hm....

This is why critiquing is important... Ive never thought of any of this...

Thanks everybody for the constructive stuff. Is there anywhere I could look online that has more about the colors in the shadow type thing? I understand what you mean I just don't know the specifics. I have to try and figure this out In photoshop.
*runs off to photoshop*
Squeaks

(lol thanks bunches AsterAzul, that boosted my confidence..)