An observation, and a question.

[Prettysenshi]

I debated posting in this thread but eh, it's really not that serious.

I just stopped posting here really because I grew up, and realize 99% of the connections I made here I guess were trivial and based on stupid shit. So I moved on. The people I still want to talk to, I talk to, and it's honestly more fun that way. The art was never the reason I joined here. I joined here for help on my website and stuck around cuz of the community, which yes, was insular. IDK, it's like two year old stuff. I can't even call it drama because it was the internet. It doesn't really affect my offline life, which is the only life I have that really matters. I've done and said so many dumb things in relation to this forum, that to come around here sometimes is kind of pointless and embarrassing for myself. I grew up, and remembered that CG is just a forum. It's really as far as that.

Besides that, I do think this place is dying. Times have changed. Most forums die, it's not that serious. Those who really want this forum to survive should get over trying to bring back the oldies. They more than likely will never come back. Get over it. Just focus on making the forum fun for those who still want to come around and be a part of the CG community. Work on your damn comics, since this site is a forum for a webcomic host. Pretty pictures will bring in new blood and then CG may last the next two years or something.

And yes, going back to whoever brought this up like 7 pages ago or something, the IRC thing I'm pretty sure killed the forums. That whole dramatic fallout thing I believe just made everyone go...."Well, that was pointless." I'm still side with Zwuh when he said that such behavior became commonplace and honestly, it was just too dumb and over the top, and everyone kind of go over it and left.

In short, I dont' come by here anymore really. It's nothing personal, if anyone even cares really. I still talk to the people who I think are cool, and I think everyone else who has left does too. It's still a community of sorts, but the interaction is just not happening within the forum anymore.

[Terotrous]

Maybe the secret to bringing the community back is we all have to get off our butts and start drawing again?

Whoa, now. Let's not get all crazy here.

In all seriousness, I think it may be the answer. After all, it was our shared interest in drawing comics that brought us here and we used to talk about comic-related issues a lot. Now that there's less drawing going on that rarely happens anymore.

Of course, it could easily be one of those cases where the medicine is worse than the disease.

[Mercury Hat]

The community itself, though, is hurting, whether it's a sign of doom for the comic site or not. We need new blood and rededication from the oldsters. Don't know how we go about doing that. In the meantime, maybe combining Off Topic and General Discussion as well as getting rid of Comic Pitching might help.

I wouldn't necessarily be opposed to a merger, there's enough overlap now as it is. I don't see how Comic Pitching is dragging us down, unless you just mean the hit-and-run nature of the threads there.

[Yeahduff]

Was mostly thinking about streamlining the main menu. Can't think of a prominent boarder whose come out of Comic Pitching. I suppose it keeps the clutter out of GD/OT, though.

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

[Phact0rri]

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

People got pissed off at one another.

The IRC crowd split off from the main chat room to another one.

so now there are just two ingroups of people and a seperation between people.

suppose thats it in a nutshell.

[Killbert-Robby]

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

People got pissed off at one another.

The IRC crowd split off from the main chat room to another one.

so now there are just two ingroups of people and a seperation between people.

suppose thats it in a nutshell.

*JUST TWO* ingroups?

[Pimpette]

there were at least four or five different chats besides #keenspace before that particular cutoff.

And now there are more.
I don't think it had much of an effect on the boards though, they were already pretty slow at that point.

[Terotrous]

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

People got pissed off at one another.

The IRC crowd split off from the main chat room to another one.

so now there are just two ingroups of people and a seperation between people.

suppose thats it in a nutshell.

You're saying there's an entirely different Keenspace chatroom somewhere?

[RPin]

Off Topic is no more? Since when?

[Tim]

Off Topic is no more? Since when?

Since two days ago.

You need to visit more often.

[RPin]

It's kind of weird to see it go. But I liked the KS forums better when everything was condensed here.

[McDuffies]

Was mostly thinking about streamlining the main menu. Can't think of a prominent boarder whose come out of Comic Pitching. I suppose it keeps the clutter out of GD/OT, though.

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

Can't say that I understand everything to a point but what I gathered:

-One person insists on talking about sexual subjects. You gather from someone's comment during the chat that this person insists on sexual discussion all the time while she's in chatroom. Many people complain about this. I've participated in many sexual discussions in my time and weren't flamed by anyone, so I can only assume that this went further than any sex discussion I saw.

-Counting people who spoke their mind, it seems like a number of people who complained is rather overwhelming compared to people who liked this course of conversation. Anyways, offending person pays no attention to complains and she and her supporters claim that their sex discussion is what's keeping chat interesting (or something like that).

-Someone apparently talks about this to Neko in private, because he suddenly logs into the chatroom, bans troublesome person, and goes away without saying a word.

-Those people who liked sexual conversation (let's call them sex fans) explode in rage and talk about injustice for what seems like hours. They claim that banned person was very important in social life of the chat, "a pillar". A few chatters who didn't like initial discussion still object to handling it the way Neko did but they generally aren't as vocal as others.

-Remus, the most vocal of sex fans, talks a lot about percieved elitism on this forum, the same story you've probably heard him say on forums. Mostly he complains about the choice of people who get to be chat mods. When I used to visit chat, everyone was automatically made a mod, so apparently since I last visited, that changed. Anyways, now sex fans, none of which are mods, request that someone unbans the banned person, but noone present obligues.

-K-Dawg eventually sees the commotion and unbans her. Not noticing this, irritated by Dawg's somewhat ironic tone, Remus throws a bunch of insults at him. After he learns that the person is unbanned, he calms down without apologuising for insluts.

Note that this is not actually where chat split. Years prior to that, people tended to form smaller, more private chatrooms where they'd invite people they liked. This was not only because of animosity between members, but also because KS chat became very large, fast and hard to follow. Some people stopped visiting main chat when they were immersed into one of smaller chats, others remained, following more chats at the same time. Last time I visited main chat before this incident, it was full of people unknown to me, and most of people I knew left, probably to smaller chats.

[Phact0rri]

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

People got pissed off at one another.

The IRC crowd split off from the main chat room to another one.

so now there are just two ingroups of people and a seperation between people.

suppose thats it in a nutshell.

*JUST TWO* ingroups?

like I know. ha ha. I'm to cool to keep up with all the nerd-cliques these days.

[Prettysenshi]

Just for the record, I believe that the reason only a few people were mods and not everyone was because someone got ban happy and people found it an abuse of power. Why particular individuals were chosen to be mods I have no idea.

[K-Dawg]

Was mostly thinking about streamlining the main menu. Can't think of a prominent boarder whose come out of Comic Pitching. I suppose it keeps the clutter out of GD/OT, though.

Can I get a(n objective as possible) Cliff's Notes on the IRC drama? I can't read that nonsense.

Can't say that I understand everything to a point but what I gathered:

-One person insists on talking about sexual subjects. You gather from someone's comment during the chat that this person insists on sexual discussion all the time while she's in chatroom. Many people complain about this. I've participated in many sexual discussions in my time and weren't flamed by anyone, so I can only assume that this went further than any sex discussion I saw.

-Counting people who spoke their mind, it seems like a number of people who complained is rather overwhelming compared to people who liked this course of conversation. Anyways, offending person pays no attention to complains and she and her supporters claim that their sex discussion is what's keeping chat interesting (or something like that).

-Someone apparently talks about this to Neko in private, because he suddenly logs into the chatroom, bans troublesome person, and goes away without saying a word.

-Those people who liked sexual conversation (let's call them sex fans) explode in rage and talk about injustice for what seems like hours. They claim that banned person was very important in social life of the chat, "a pillar". A few chatters who didn't like initial discussion still object to handling it the way Neko did but they generally aren't as vocal as others.

-Remus, the most vocal of sex fans, talks a lot about percieved elitism on this forum, the same story you've probably heard him say on forums. Mostly he complains about the choice of people who get to be chat mods. When I used to visit chat, everyone was automatically made a mod, so apparently since I last visited, that changed. Anyways, now sex fans, none of which are mods, request that someone unbans the banned person, but noone present obligues.

-K-Dawg eventually sees the commotion and unbans her. Not noticing this, irritated by Dawg's somewhat ironic tone, Remus throws a bunch of insults at him. After he learns that the person is unbanned, he calms down without apologuising for insluts.

Note that this is not actually where chat split. Years prior to that, people tended to form smaller, more private chatrooms where they'd invite people they liked. This was not only because of animosity between members, but also because KS chat became very large, fast and hard to follow. Some people stopped visiting main chat when they were immersed into one of smaller chats, others remained, following more chats at the same time. Last time I visited main chat before this incident, it was full of people unknown to me, and most of people I knew left, probably to smaller chats.

Summed up very well.

And for those saying this was when all the other chats began...WRONG!

Most of these newer chats were created well before the amgoth incident began. I do have to say what I always find funny are people being mad that these other chats exist...so what if they exist? Is it not normal for friends to want to speak to each other and not to a bunch of people the don't really care to associate with?

But then again my opinion shouldn't really matter since I am a "sycophantic lackey"

[RPin]

Just for the record, I believe that the reason only a few people were mods and not everyone was because someone got ban happy and people found it an abuse of power. Why particular individuals were chosen to be mods I have no idea.

I think that whoever is mod today are the ones who bothered to set up so the channel would auto mod them. Everyone that cared could do it back then.

[McDuffies]

But then again my opinion shouldn't really matter since I am a "sycophantic lackey"

Dammit you made it sound like some cool title and now I want one.

[Pimpette]

we used to automatically just op people who came in

and then for like a few days or a week we suddenly had this random influx of people from other chats who would come in, cry for ops, and then kickban everyone they could. Every five minutes.
So we stopped opping people. Those of us who were there at the time and had our nicks registered with chanserv because auto-ops and we just don't op anyone else anymore.

[Jim North]

So, wait, when you say "random influx of people from other chats", do you mean people from these other Keenspace chats, or just random people period that had nothing to do with CG?

I mean, everyone getting opped or not doesn't really matter to me since I haven't been in IRC in forever and don't plan on going back to it anytime soon, it's just that . . . well, it seems kind of odd to me for CG people getting their ops taken away because non-CG people are assholes.

Maybe I'm just reading it wrong.

[McDuffies]

So, wait, when you say "random influx of people from other chats", do you mean people from these other Keenspace chats, or just random people period that had nothing to do with CG?

I mean, everyone getting opped or not doesn't really matter to me since I haven't been in IRC in forever and don't plan on going back to it anytime soon, it's just that . . . well, it seems kind of odd to me for CG people getting their ops taken away because non-CG people are assholes.

Maybe I'm just reading it wrong.

The second.
They probably didn't have another way of immidiately discerning real chatters from trolls. Note that people who retained their ops are roughly the same people who fought to get everyone to have ops at the beginning, when chatroom was started.