Serious Crit. Needed Please!

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:25 am

I need some serious critique for this fanart (Chii from the anime Chobits). I'm taking it to an art auction so please don't hold back; I need all the critique I can get. Plus this needs to be done in 2 weeks ^^;. So I really need help so I don't miss the deadline.

Here it is (sorry for the bad quality, it's too big to scan; 14x17):

Starline · Post by **Starline** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 11:51 am

I don't know if its the angle you drew it at, but her head looks to small for her body. I don't recall Chi's character have that large of chest.
But looks nice otherwise.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 12:32 pm

Okay, thanks

. I'll fix those two things.

Prettysenshi · Post by **Prettysenshi** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 12:52 pm

starline wrote:I don't know if its the angle you drew it at, but her head looks to small for her body. I don't recall Chi's character have that large of chest.
But looks nice otherwise.

I agree. Something about the angle of the shot is off, but besides that, it's a really good picture.

Post by **Mercury Hat** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 1:22 pm

It seems to me that the head and neck are too far back, like the head should be moved forward more and sit more over the chest. As it is, it looks to me like the neck curves up and back too far for that sort of angle.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Sun Oct 02, 2005 2:17 pm

I see what you're saying; now that I look at it again it does look odd. Thanks.

Castle_Builder · Post by **Castle_Builder** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 9:31 am

FIRST: sorry this is so damn long . . . I was only going to do a brief comment but got a bit carried away . . .

I did a quick sketch . . . in MS Paint oddly enough . . . of what I think people are talking about.

Given you have already fleshed out a lot of the detail I don't know if you want to take the time to alter it, but as it's for an auction it may be worth while.

The left sketch is what it looks like you did. The blue line represents the spine. As you can see there is a HUGE gap between the left shoulder and the left breast.

I can understand that from a perspective standpoint the closer things are the greater a gap between them as oposed to thos far away. Like looking down a city street, but with people it is RARE that there is ever such a big gap and it really throws off the pic.

My first impression was, "Where is the left shoulder?" I know it's under the hair, but it's so far behind her neck line that it looks like she is purposefully arching her back and pointing her shoulders behind her. But that doesn't seem consistent with the rest of her body language so I figure it was unintentional. And it really makes that left breast look like a mutant or something kind of like it's trying to get away from her.

The right sketch in red is more anatomically correct in that there is a direct relation as to proportion and placement between breast and shoulders because where the shoulder is has a direct effect on the breast.

The second issue is with the legs and how they connect to the body

Again the sketch on the left is yours.

The way the picture looks, her body is more or less with its side to us, BUT you have her butt behind her body . . . more importantly it's her left buttcheek where her left lef connects to the body. if you try turning your body to do what is in the picture you will find yourself needing to be double jointed in some very odd spots.

PAY A LOT OF ATTENTION TO THE BELLY BUTTON.

IF you want the chest sideways but her legs pointed away from the viewer then the belly button points away, the left butt cheek is to the LEFT of her body and more importantly to the LEFT of the RIGHT butt cheek. The way it is not the left buttcheek is to the right of the right buttcheek which makes the position impossible, even though the knees are set up perfectly for this position.

IF you want the chest sideways but the belly kind of more pointed to the viewer then the butt is in the right place but the knees are off, meaning the left leg should be shorter then the right one.

In any case I'm actually somewhat doubt I made any sense there, although hopefully you got the idea. Hard to explain without showing you.

All the detail is fantastic. You have a good grasp of clothing and hair so I think all that is fine, it's just the anatomy I think could be worked on.

Try getting an action figure, or one of those little wooden art dummies, or just grab a sports illustrated swimsuit issue or a Maxim and look at the poses the women are in . . . or better yet, have a friend pose for you.

Oh . . . as to the head. It is a bit small which makes the neck look really long, but it's more of a minor issue in my opinion. Still . . . consider that the face alone is about the sice of a persons outstretched hand plus a little for forehead and hair etc.

Well . . . I hope that was helpful and good luck with the auction.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 12:37 pm

No, you didn't write too much! It helps, because anatomy has *never* been my think. I love adding all the pretty stuff but anatomy...urg! That's the main reason why I made this thread. I was happy with the concept of the pic but I knew it looked...funny.

I'll fix what you said and post the revised version. Thank you!!

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 2:54 pm

With the corrections (again..the quality...sorry -_-;):

I'm happy about it...but the legs...I dunno. Take a look:

Yeah...I plan to ink it today, so I can start coloring (coloring takes me longer, so I need to hurry and finish this lineart). So if it still looks funky, please tell me ^^;

Castle_Builder · Post by **Castle_Builder** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 3:53 pm

You're getting much closer I think.

A couple thoughts:

The body still seems a little off balance to me. Like she's about to tip over. I'm assuming that her left arm is back behind her balancing her as if she were sitting on the ground and shes leaning back on her arm, but without actually seeing it it makes the position look a bit uncomfortable.

Proportion wise I tried this:

Since she has a fairly short body from waist to neck I feel the legs could be shortened a but. Her left breast could be widened a little and the right edge of it (the clevage) could be moved over a little.

Keep in mind that when she puts her left arm back it pulls on her breast and stretches it a bit.

I also adjusted the waist a little, consider the triangle from belly button to each shoulder as the upper body. This "V" is almost always visible. Especially in comics because it excentuates the female form and makes her more sexy/feminine. It does not have to be significant. I just dented her right side a bit, instead of having it straight down.

You also might want to have her head a bit more down ward and have her looking at the photo. That would create a more intimate scene. Like we as the view are looking in upon a private moment.

With this I also brought her legs up and folded them behind her like shes sitting in a grassy field. Thus her skirt has to flow onto the ground and not fall straight down.

I think the folded legs might work a bit better for the pose she is in. Maybe put her on a bed or in a grassy field.

I think the sitting legs can work too, dont get me wrong. I kind of like my first sketch up there with the shortened legs, but the folded legs might be an idea if you think her postion looks awkward because when you have folded legs like that the body naturally looks more acceptable if a little off balance.

I don't know. Just something to think about.

EDIT: The more I look at it the more I think I might just be being a little nit picky. It looks pretty good the way it is.

In any case . . . take pics as you go and post them. I'd be interested to see the progression from line art to ink to color.

Post by **Mercury Hat** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 4:13 pm

The legs as you have them bulge out awkwardly at the thighs and the calves, to me

.

Warofwinds · Post by **Warofwinds** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:03 pm

I definitely agree with Castle Builder on shortening up the legs, but the main thing that's getting me is the line of the corset-like top she's wearing. To me it looks off too much to the right, and widens on the wrong side at the bottom. But as for the thighs and calves, it looks more realistic than anime, 'cause real women actually have thighs to bulge. But yeah, mostly for me is the center line. If you look at the triangle CB provided, it should center around the apex. It's off to the right, but only at the far bottom.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 5:26 pm

I'm so lame; can't believe I don't see these things -_-;

Thanks for helping me! I like the legs under the skirt thing better, and I was thinking of making her sit on a bed, so you read my mind there. I'll definatly fix it up again and post it probably tomorrow. I think I can stand to wait until Thursday or Friday to ink it.

Post by **Mercury Hat** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 6:54 pm

Nicotine wrote:I'm so lame; can't believe I don't see these things -_-;

Well the problem with looking at your own artwork for mistakes is that a lot of the time, you're seeing what you want to see as opposed to what's really there. A good way to check your drawings yourself is to hold them up to a mirror or look at them from behind so the image is flipped. Things might be out of place that you hadn't noticed before, it'll really help

.

This is the same reason why you shouldn't edit your own papers or stories, you'll end up skipping over mistakes and filling in the correction in your mind.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Mon Oct 03, 2005 9:18 pm

Mercury Hat wrote:
Nicotine wrote:I'm so lame; can't believe I don't see these things -_-;
Well the problem with looking at your own artwork for mistakes is that a lot of the time, you're seeing what you want to see as opposed to what's really there. A good way to check your drawings yourself is to hold them up to a mirror or look at them from behind so the image is flipped. Things might be out of place that you hadn't noticed before, it'll really help .

This is the same reason why you shouldn't edit your own papers or stories, you'll end up skipping over mistakes and filling in the correction in your mind.

Thanks ^^;. I'll make sure I try that sometime, it'll make things less fustraiting

.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:38 pm

The latest version. I hope it's right/close because I have to start inking tomorrow or Friday:

Prettysenshi · Post by **Prettysenshi** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 3:42 pm

Nicotine wrote:The latest version. I hope it's right/close because I have to start inking tomorrow or Friday:

Much better. The angle has improved and her legs don't seem unproportional in my opinion. Good luck with the auction.

Warofwinds · Post by **Warofwinds** » Wed Oct 05, 2005 5:20 pm

Two little itty bitty things:

Her left breast needs to come over the frills I think, and the hair across her right breast looks kind of flat. That's it for me, but remember, it always looks better inked^^ Good luck with this!

Castle_Builder · Post by **Castle_Builder** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 7:51 am

Good stuff.

I like that I can see the left arm.

Came a long way.

Look forward to seeing it inked and colored.

Nicotine · Post by **Nicotine** » Thu Oct 06, 2005 1:04 pm

Thank you so much guys! I plan to start inking it today.