Comic Genesis Forums

Um... hi.

I'm finally becoming comfortable with the style of art and the way the characters look at "Et-cetera," so I thought I'd open it up to critiqueing. I'd like to make a couple points first, though:

- The characters are meant to be, to some degree, "cute." Not chibi, but cute.
- I am still ironing out details (trying to find the exact "look" for each character) as my ideals change daily; this causes a lot of changes in style throughout only a few months. I apologize.

Please, if you offer a critique, give me a hint, as well. I don't like hearing, "Your conversation bubbles are wretched" without being given a link to someplace that explains "good" conversation bubbles.

Right. Done now. I'm a wordy little thing, aren't I?

<a href="http://etc.keenspace.com/" TARGET="_NEW">Et-cetera</a>

- Pchuu!

Well, I enjoyed reading through your archives.

My thoughts aren't very collected right now, but I can say a few things.

The ad has to be visible on all pages without scrolling. Most people put it at the very top.

Also, the caption on Ophilia's shirt changes (the slash through "virgins" goes away). I'm not sure if this was intentional or not, but it kinda stood out.

http://etc.keenspace.com/d/20031214.html
This is a classic example of why cut-and-paste doesn't always work. Lucky's expression in the fourth panel makes no sense given what he's saying. Also, the way you colour his hair makes it look sorta detached from his head... like it's on a different layer or something. Perhaps someone with better art knowledge could explain this.

I might check back on this. It's well done. I'm curious to see if you can keep doing this daily. Keep up the good work.

Nice one! The characters I like. They're believable and actually entertaining.

The difference between art styles is sometimes a bit jarring, but all in all I like it.

Ya, the ad needs to be on top. It doesn't have to be the only thing on top, you can have your comic banner, etc. Now, since your whole site design is in grayscale and the ad is often in color, there are some techniques to make it lower-impact.

Because a computer screen uses projected RGB light, light colors such as white, yellow, cyan, and magenta are brighter than the three primaries, red, green, and blue, or black, the absence of light.

On my site http://taiwanimation.keenspace.com/, the top ad banner area has a darker background than the section with the comic. This makes the section with the comic stand out.

Optimal page layout would place the comic banner where it is right now, the ad banner right of it. Design the comic banner to lead the viewer straight down to the comic, and also you can use tables so that only the background behind the ad is a darker color.

I actually only read the first few strips. The characters seemed kinda mean to me. Especially the parents. One joke about how the daughter is better off sick or dead than leaving is funny. Several close together is a sick person who really needs help.

Maybe it's just a little too much, or maybe it's that you kinda did the same joke a few days in a row. I don't know, I just didn't find it funny after the first few strips.

Heheheh.... mean.... I was thinking I was looking for something like this... That's cool, everyone likes a different flavor of soda pop.

Your style is much improved from the beginnings. It seems a little too cut-and-paste-y at the moment, and the characters are a little stiff, but I like it a lot. Especially the huge eyes that are almost closed. They betray a good deal of boredom, incredulity and hostility. You could use some work on your backgrounds, though, particularly with perspective. I don't know any sites, but basically, you should have all lines on a plane going toward the same point. Maybe someone can dig out a visual for you. The backgrounds don't have to have abundant detail, but just enough to match the style of your characters.

Nice start. I'll probably be back.

Yeah, it's not the kind of stuff that is gonna make everyone have the same reaction that I did. I can see why other people like it.

I think my post came off a little harsh. I didn't feel like the characters were mean, horrible people. Just a little rougher than my personal tastes.

And I didn't mean to single you out. My apologies. Come. I'll buy you a drink.

Um... hi.

Thanks for all the tips. I'll definately try to do a redesign on the site as soon as I can... which may be a few days, since I'm a college student working 20 hours a week.

To reply to some of the criticism (constructive or not):

- Yeah, Lucky's hair was giving me migraines... which is why he now has a different style, and colour

- The characters aren't so much mean as they are jaded and sarcastic... because I am. I have no tact and I say whatever is on my mind whenever it is on my mind. Therefore, rather than putting puppies and butterflies all over the comic, I made it realistic. I know this won't appeal to everyone, but I'm holding guns to no one's head and telling them to read (and, actually, someone e-mailed me and told me her mother told her the same thing when she moved out).

- I've been looking for places to put in backgrounds... but, the first few comics have been about moving into an apartment which, therefore, has blank walls. There's very little I can do with blanks walls. That is changing, however, and there will be more background stuff going up soon.

Thanks for all the great feedback. I very much appreciate the hints.

- Pchuu!

I read through Et-cetera shortly after this thread was started. I didn't reply then because I'm not sure what to think of it. For me it was sort of like having someone hand you a good popcicle then finding out that it's just not the right flavor of purple.

Your style is interesting. It has improved (refined might be a better word) considerably in just a few strips. The look is really unique. You do have some perspective problems, but others have pointed that out already.
(In case you haven't see this before: http://wapsisquare.keenspot.com/. Your strip reminds me of this one a little.)

Your have a lot of nice story elements happening here. Your characters are quirky and you've made a good start on showing off those quirks. For some reason, though, I just can't connect with the characters like I feel I should. To me they seem like actors speaking their lines. They act out the scenes right. They always remember their lines but there is just something wrong with the delivery. They don't have the right energy for the parts they play. I hope that made sense.

Um... hi.

Thank you, Faub. Yes, your reply did make sense--but I'm not quite sure what you mean by "They don't have the right energy for the parts they play." Bingo is quietly sarcastic, Megara is quirky, Ophelia is jaded and Lucky is usually tottering along in the background trying to figure out what's going on. If you could clear up that statement, I'd very much appreciate it.

Thank you for the help, and for the compliments on the refining of the style.

- Pchuu!

reminds me of wapsysquare, though it is kinda lacking energy - perhaps make use of action lines, special effects and such? For exsample when she grabbed the guy's shirt and shook her fist - make action lines around the fist and folds in the cloth where she grabbed?



I hope you don't mind that I played with it around a bit to illustrate what I mean.

I sorta agree with Faub (I usually do). I'm not sure making everyone's actions more extreme will do anything for you, since your style is rather deadpan. It may be more that you need to get to know your characters more, live with them a little while longer. Which of course, you just can't fix like that. As I read Etcetera, I found it had lots of potential and had a real neat style and tone, but it wasn't quite clicking. The good news is that it seems we're not seeing your best, that you have a lot of great things your keeping from us. The bad news.... it'll take a while for these things to surface. I think that your real problem is you're new, and are still feeling all of this out. You've just been compared to Wapsi Square, one of the best things out there. Clearly your not gonna be quite to that level yet, but seeing as you've drawn those comparisons already, you're probably on the right track. My advice: Just stick with it.

Sorry Faub if I horribly misunderstood you.

Some of the lines just don't seem right. In the first comic, she's talking about leaving her childhood home. That made me think there was some kind of flashback going on. Nobody refers to the place they live in right now as their "childhood" home. The only time I've ever heard that phrase is when people have lived in a few places inbetween there and where they are now. Other than that, you're just leaving home.

I think this kind of thing is why the characters seem a little like actors reading lines. The things they say don't always sound conversational.

CodeGuy wrote:Nobody refers to the place they live in right now as their "childhood" home.

Um... hi.

<B>I</b> do. I've lived in the same town in the same house my entire life. To me, it IS my "childhood home."

I appreciate everyone's suggestions on the conversation, but the fact is this: they talk the way I talk. I'm usually pretty quietly sarcastic. I'm a stealth apathetic. I don't know how to get across a happy, bouncy character, and wouldn't even try at this point, since it wouldn't fit in with the story arcs. I'd like to try and make their personalities more understandable to the audience, but I'm not sure how.

As for "action lines," I don't tend to like them very much and use them sparingly. There is wrinkling on Lucky's shirt on the <A href="http://etc.keenspace.com/d/20040110.html">Jan. 10th</a> comic, but it is subtle rather than over the top. I prefer subtlety to hitting someone in the face with the situation.

Thanks for the comparison to Wapsi Square, although I'm having trouble seeing the similarity, besides the fact that they both feature girls with large breasts as main characters--which isn't that striking of a similarity, at least not to me.

- Pchuu!

I think everybody's said whatever comments it is I would make already, so I'll just say that you might consider using .PNG format for your color strips instead of GIF, it's a much more powerful format for comics like yours that are mostly solid-color fills.

Otherwise, I really enjoyed reading through your comics.

Hmm... well...

To be honest it's just not my kind of comic. It's not my style and not my humor. But that's okay. Other people will probably love it!

You have distinguished characters - at least in the way they look - they're easy to recognise and your style is consitent (after the beginning).

However, what I really miss is some... completeness... a sense that it's going somewhere, or that it has something to do with something. Sounds a bit confusing I guess...

Well, I'd like to point you to this comic *points* Philosophy Bites. If you take a look at the archives... *clicks* You'll see that the comics have a theme. If you have the time, you might want to read a couple of those themes, just to check out the way Terotrous works his themes out. I'm not sure if you'll like his humor, but I'm sure you'll get a basic idea of what I mean.

With your comic, I get the feeling it's a bit random-like... if I were to describe what you have so far... I'd probably say something like this:
"It is a comic about a girl who moves away from her parents. She has a friend and a room mate. She doesn't like her neighbour but her room mate does. Oh, and her friend gets a new haircut."

I'm not trying to say that your comic is bad, or that you're a bad artist... just to make sure everyone understands. I'm just trying to help here...

If you feel like asking questions or want me to make things clear, feel free to do so...

Good luck!

HAH! I have to say, I've LOVED what I've read so far. Your humor reminds me fondly of Daria in its heyday... Your art style is fine. Previous comments about perspective etc. all qualify, but overall I have to say that this is incredibly funny. The "Babies taste like chicken" shirt had me laughing till I nearly cried. The C+P art doesn't bother me so much (I do a C+P comic myself; yes, I know, I'm a slacker), and I find the characters vastly amusing and distinct. . In short, something I'm putting in my "read this daily" list. Seriously, keep up the good work.

Just thought I'd give my "go Chuu!" comment ^-^ I'm definitely checking back for more.