Get Ya Freak On.

[McDuffies]

Keff, I seem to recall that you mentioned that you tend to listen through album mostly by rotating songs that caught your ear at first (though I can't find actual post where you said it now).
Thing is, besides early "Bends", I can't think of a Radiohead album that is instantly listenable. Even later, less hermetic In Rainbows and Hail to the Thief, don't grab your ear right away and take some time.
Also, most of their albums, particularly OK Computer, Kid A and Amnesiac, make a larger whole than a sum of their parts, so it's kinda shame not to listen them from beginning to the end.
Perhaps patience is a clue. I don't see why you should be imune to Radiohead's qualities. Phactori is a different story, he and I have rather different tastes and I wouldn't dare reccomend him music - though I'm a bit surprised if, given his synth roots, he doesn't at least like Everything In It's Right Place and Ideoteque from Kid A.
You're different thing. You like Caribou, so Radiohead can't be that far fetched.

I can tell you what I like about Radiohead, and you see if anything of that hits you.

First, I'm a sucker for experimental songwriting, for unusual meters and chord progressions, for dysharmonic stuff, strange sounds, for shifts in the middle of the song. Ie I like math-rocky stuff, but none of math rock groups (except maybe Battles) ever made it big or made singable tunes.
Radiohead on the other hand - it was kind of relevation when I caught myself singing Everything In The Right Place while walking the street, the song was stuck in my ears like some commercial jingle - and this is the song transcribed in 9/8, 19/8, or other impossible meters. It's complicated, yet it works.
And then, there are details. Same song has singer's voice often burried in noise or chopped in pieces, and then picking itself together and managing to outloud the noise again - effect is very suggestiv. Or, to stick with Kid A, How To Dissapear Completely which at first seems like ordinary slow piece in vein of Fade Out, but then you have these sounds that are disharmonic, that seem to bear no conncetion with the song, they just appear and then dissapear, and since the theme of the song and the feeling it tries to evoke is that floating, spaceless sensation, they seem like objects flying past you and brushing against you for a moment. The same idea was further elaborated in Pyramide Song on Amnesiac, where you are being burried under layers of sounds, like you would be under layers of water. They are songs-experiences, where you may just close your eyes and let sensations overwhelm you.
Or, Karma Police from OK Computer where key changes at the last part and you never even notice, or Electionering where, if you follow closely, guitar parts don't match singing and harmony at all but rather get crazy over scales, or Life In a Glass House which ends guitar/electronica filled Amnesiac with jazz brass that sounds like mourning - and it works, and that's the thing, whatever madman idea they try, they make it work and sound good, and it all started with those two nervous guitar slams that introduce refrain in "Creep".

Second thing is that they always make albums with much thought of how they'll hold as whole. They're not conceptual albums in that they don't tell a story or message, but - OK Computer, Kid A and Amnesiac in particular - are albums that portray some panoramic view through their songs like pieces - on OK Computer it's one hermetic, computerized view, and on Kid A one darker, apocalyptic, paranoia-filled view with imminent aproaching of danger. I appreciate that they can make listening of an album into a whole experience yet not prevent you from listening individual songs like prog rockers would.

Then there's the thing that is not neccesarily related to their music, but to the way they direct their career. They've never made two albums in same vein, and before making any of them, they give a thought to which direction to go, what is the logical continuement of their career. Guys realised that to stay fresh and good, they have to be one step ahead of their audience and surprise them every time, and they don't wait to milk one style before they progress to the next.
For a listener it's a joy to await for the next album and see what is the next thing they'll come up with, but for us as artists I think that it's important statement to have artists of such strong integrity and people who guide their career by constantly taking risks - to exist and to be that succesful.
It's a sort of iconic moment when, short after releasing Kid A, they were invited to SNL, and apparently everyone expected a rock band on stage, but instead they got guys tampering with electronic gadgets, Yorke working his "spastic movements" coreography and Johny Greenwood hunching over his ondes martenot thing like some sort of madman. Together with music, it must have sounded like some sort of prank. If that's not cool, then I don't know what cool is.

Particular albums?
Pablo Honey is them before they found their style, there's a few songs that hint to future Radiohead among which Creep, but mostly alternative rock in vein of Pixies.

The Bends - like I said, most accessible album with high hit rate, and if you've listened to it, I'm surprised that at least several songs haven't hooked you.

OK Computer was still alternative rock, but much more complex sound than Bends and somewhat more innacesible songs. You prolly know No Surprises which is to me one of weaker songs, but Karma Police is wonderful and intentionally anticlimactic, Paranoid Android, and my personal favourites are Lucky and Climbing Up The Walls, which is a sort of David Lynch-type horror song.

Kid A was made after they decided that trying to live up to comparision with OK Computer would be pointless, so they turned to electronics. Recording sessions were marathon, in the end they picked weirdest, most hermetic songs, those in which they completely rejected pop form, and assembled them into Kid A. It's probably the most difficult album, though also most rewarding, access points are probably How To Dissapear Completely, Optimistic, Ideoteque.
Next year, Amnesiac was released with other songs from those sessions, it was a sort of brighter, less paranoic twin brother though also a lot of experimental electronica. A lot of great saongs though I particularly liked Like Spinning Plates which was based on another song played in reverse - I know for a fact that this song can be sung along while drunk.

Hail to the Thief was their more shapeless album, a kind of overly long album where electronic pieces alternate with guitar pieces. I think that the album is a decent introduction point because it offers all sides of their work in a bit more accesible shape - there was 2+2=5 if you wanted punky and Sit Down Stand Up if you wanted mantra, Sail To The Moon if you wanted moody ballad and Backdrifts if you wanted cheerful electronica...
Mind you it's not their strongest ever, because album is an hour long and drags along in the middle - I guess they just decided to throw everything they made this time, and not be so selective.
I might be wrong about that suggestion because In Rainbows is definitely stronger later-period material than Hail but also it doesn't have songs as instantly captivating as Wold at the Door.

But either is probably good. See, they're too different to be lightly compared to each other, and as a measure of how individual that is, my guitar player liked Kid A better than others, even at first listen - he's a kind of guy who listens to Tool, Mars Volta, King Crismon or Dillinger Escape Plan.

But in any case you should give a chance to some of later albums and not expect something that will strike you and hook you up instantly.

P.S. Yorke also made solo album, mostly minimalistic arrangements, drum machine piano and him, lotsa good tunes.

[Sincerely]

Did you seriously just start a thread so you could proselytize a musical group?

[CaptainClaude]

did you post to use today's word of the day from your calender?

[Ahaugen]

Did you seriously just start a thread so you could proselytize a musical group?

that quote pretty much sums up the Internet as a whole (if you disregard all the parts that are porn)

[Killbert-Robby]

Thing is, besides early "Bends", I can't think of a Radiohead album that is instantly listenable. Even later, less hermetic In Rainbows and Hail to the Thief, don't grab your ear right away and take some time.

So its music you have to force yourself to like?

[Phact0rri]

Thom Yorke's solo stuff is pretty awesome.

Though I gotta say in your definition of digging experimental song writing we should have more in common that we do. ^_^ seriously I do love listening to your recommendations as I do respect your opinions, whether agree with them or not... you address things well.

Thing is, besides early "Bends", I can't think of a Radiohead album that is instantly listenable. Even later, less hermetic In Rainbows and Hail to the Thief, don't grab your ear right away and take some time.

So its music you have to force yourself to like?

I think he means you have to absorb it. its like reading a book with big words. you sometimes have to reread a sentence or two to get the full gist of what it means.

[McDuffies]

Did you seriously just start a thread so you could proselytize a musical group?

Heh heh, did someone just thought that this was the first page of the thread?

Though I gotta say in your definition of digging experimental song writing we should have more in common that we do. ^_^ seriously I do love listening to your recommendations as I do respect your opinions, whether agree with them or not... you address things well.

Oh I respect your musical taste, it's just that when it comes to what hits you on purely emotional level, I think that we are rather different.

I think he means you have to absorb it. its like reading a book with big words. you sometimes have to reread a sentence or two to get the full gist of what it means.

In a way.
It's not a group that offers instant gratification.
What gets into your head easily, gets out easily too. Summer hits are produced to be instantly likeable, but after a short while you get bored with them and forget them. Some other songs are made to last in your conscience, and sometimes they don't stick at first listening, but on long term they are more rewarding listen because they're richer, deeper, and simply worth listening over and over.
I don't mind people who choose to listen to instant hits. Different people ask different things from music. Someone just needs something to whistle to, others ask more of music, a sort of message, insight, experience, a deeper communication between author and listener. Some people choose to put a lot of effort into listening their music, others choose not to.
I have to point though, I believe that however innacessible music is, it has to intrigue you. Most of music that I listen to, I can't say that I liked it at first listen, but I was intrigued by it at first listen.
It's actually like reading some heavier book: after reading it, you may not like it. After a month or two, you may realise that you actually like it now, only it took some time for impressions to settle down, to get it.

Robby should know all this. He claims that he liked "Stalker", and that is not a film that you can fully appreciate after the first viewing. It's made that way.
But Robby puts a lot of effort here into taking my words out of context and misunderstanding them. With such attitude it's hard to believe that he really wants to have a conversation here, he just wants to put someone down, to humiliate them.

[Yeahduff]

What do you find in Thom Yorke that you don't find in Radiohead? Is it a matter of too many indulgences?

Did you seriously just start a thread so you could proselytize a musical group?

Uh, no, I seriously started a thread so we could talk about music. No one's mentioned Missy Elliot in like 22 pages, so, I really don't know what you're getting at.

Thing is, besides early "Bends", I can't think of a Radiohead album that is instantly listenable. Even later, less hermetic In Rainbows and Hail to the Thief, don't grab your ear right away and take some time.

So its music you have to force yourself to like?

You don't force yourself, but not everything reveals itself in your first encounter with something. Anyone you meet you have completely figured out upon first meeting them is gonna be a pretty boring person. A review of Kid A when it first came out said something to the effect of, "It doesn't reveal everything at first, but all great pop music keeps some secrets to be discovered later."

And I think that's what's great about Radiohead. They do make pop music, it's just not all there from the beginning, it's something you have get to the bottom of.

[Phact0rri]

What do you find in Thom Yorke that you don't find in Radiohead? Is it a matter of too many indulgences?

I think he goes off on his own more. Its less of the band going "hey Thom were down here man." and there's the broken down to grassroots radiohead vibe. I wouldn't say its all that different, more like a different flavour of radiohead.

[McDuffies]

Songs from Eraser do look a bit more organic, as if they grew out of those piano riffs, from Thom tinkering with his piano and drum machine. A sort of personal "author and his instrument" album in the vein of Sea Change or Boatman's Call.
But that's actually how most of their songs became, it's just that when they finally get to record them, they're usually already elaborated songs tested in concerts - though there's a lot of invention going on during the recording too, according to O'Brien's recording diaries.
But still it's a piece of the same cloth. I find songwriting on Eraser very similar to writing on In Rainbows, and even arrangements on In Rainbows are sparcer than usual, closer to Eraser than, say, OK Computer's layered guitars.

[Phact0rri]

I find songwriting on Eraser very similar to writing on In Rainbows, and even arrangements on In Rainbows are sparcer than usual, closer to Eraser than, say, OK Computer's layered guitars.

maybe I should give Rainbows a shot. I saw a vinyl copy of it the other day, and thought about giving it a spin.. I would have if money wasn't so tight... but maybe grab a few tracks from someone to see what it sounds like.

[McDuffies]

Maybe you can still download it for choose-your-own-price?

[Phact0rri]

oh I have a friend whose as big of a radiohead fan as you. I'll have her, let me listen to a few tracks, at some point.

[McDuffies]

This band called Miniature Tigers seems nice.

[Phact0rri]

not bad. I like the tempo changes they use. the track "Last nights Fake blood" has a beach boys meets Weezer" feel I am really digging... which kind of frightens me.

Guys voice reminds me of someone else... but I'm not sure who it is.

[McDuffies]

Miniature Tigers are growing onto me. It's a kind of retro, non-threatening pop with funny lyrics.

[Yeahduff]

I'll look em up when I get home.

Been listening to The Get Up Kids. Excellent midwest power-pop/punk rock/emo that's not just high energy but with fairly complex songs and excellent instrument playing. I've come to find that Something To Write Home About, their sophomore release, is a true masterpiece.

[TheSuburbanLetdown]

They had a talented and under-rated rhythm section.

[Phact0rri]

I'll look em up when I get home.

Been listening to The Get Up Kids. Excellent midwest power-pop/punk rock/emo that's not just high energy but with fairly complex songs and excellent instrument playing. I've come to find that Something To Write Home About, their sophomore release, is a true masterpiece.

Well the second record definately upped the production value, but I duno I still have a soft spot for Four Minute Mile, but I find it hard to listen to Write about these days... cause it feels so dated. like listening to Discount. It was cool at the time, but now it feels different almost generic. But I will always have a soft spot for the Get Up Kids.

Get up kids split with Rocket From the Crypt is like the best thing ever. I miss both bands.

[TheSuburbanLetdown]

I'll look em up when I get home.

Been listening to The Get Up Kids. Excellent midwest power-pop/punk rock/emo that's not just high energy but with fairly complex songs and excellent instrument playing. I've come to find that Something To Write Home About, their sophomore release, is a true masterpiece.

Well the second record definately upped the production value, but I duno I still have a soft spot for Four Minute Mile, but I find it hard to listen to Write about these days... cause it feels so dated. like listening to Discount. It was cool at the time, but now it feels different almost generic. But I will always have a soft spot for the Get Up Kids.

Get up kids split with Rocket From the Crypt is like the best thing ever. I miss both bands.

The "Red Letter Day/Woodson" EP is one of their strongest works. The song "One Year Later" to me just screams "this is the Get Up Kids" and is the song I considered to be a good representative of midwestern post-punk emo back in the day. Emo is pretty different now, but that's how things go.

I know what you mean about "something to write home about." I can't put my finger on it, but there's something about it, though I wouldn't use the word generic. I guess hearing that version of Red Letter Day and noticing that the EP version was better kinda did it for me. "Long Goodnight" was my theme music for a while, actually.