Catch 22?

JuJuBean · Post by **JuJuBean** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 1:11 am

We have to wait to see what happens <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/frown.gif"> But what if Davids going to make us think so hard we think its the least expected person and then switch it again and make us think something completely different! But jsut because i think it's Ted whos gunna be damned it will prolly be Shan. or something o.o

PyroFox · Post by **PyroFox** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 4:20 am

Maybe they're all damned to hell now... 'Cept Kimberly, unless she did some things we don't know about...------------------
"Few things are harder to put up with than a good example."
- Mark Twain

Johnnyvague · Post by **Johnnyvague** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 10:15 am

Right now i am trying to decide if the fur "with vengance in their heart" would end up going to hell if they didn't attempt to help an attempt to save the potential victims. I keep going back and forth on it as i don't know enough about what constitutes a sin in Jack's world.On the other hand, given that Jack know the orriginal outcome (or claimed to) isn't it possible that he could be coercing the newly dead to take action while appearing to be trying to prevent them. Is one soul sent to hell worth saving the lives of those who are left?Is it worth it for the vengance that he can't take?--j

Terrycloth · Post by **Terrycloth** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 10:32 am

It looks like the shooter was pretty damn scared. They could have gotten him to surrender to the police out of fear of vengeful ghosts. That would have saved the others' lives.But then he would have gotten off as insane and lived to a ripe old age rich off the profits. Which would of course be intolerable to whoever it was who wanted revenge. (come on, it *has* to be Ted)

BladeKitsune · Post by **BladeKitsune** » Fri Nov 30, 2001 11:44 am

accully i do think id be suprised if it WASNT ted. i know how some writter's, like david, mind work they drop you every clue imaginable to believe one idea, and then turn it around and let it be the least suppected option. just cuase your pissed about being dead, and finally feel free doesnt mean your gonna take revenge on anyone.

Bryce · Post by **Bryce** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 7:18 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by johnnyvague:
On the other hand, given that Jack know the orriginal outcome (or claimed to) isn't it possible that he could be coercing the newly dead to take action while appearing to be trying to prevent them.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>That would be out of character for Jack. Remember, he and Farrago saved as many lives in that place crash in Arc 4. <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Is one soul sent to hell worth saving the lives of those who are left?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>Think of it this way... If nobody intervened and everyone did die, maybe ALL of them would have gotten into Paradise.All of them spend eternity in Heaven or one is damned for certian... I can understand John's hesitance to help...However, as TerryCloth has already said, they have the shooter scared shitless right now. Maybe they ended up only grazing him or (with any luck) take out enough of his brain where he becomes the manager of a 7-11...------------------
<A HREF="http://www.nuklearpower.com/comic/multi/8bit.htm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.nuklearpower.com/comic/multi/8bit.htm</A> [This message has been edited by Bryce (edited 12-01-2001).]

Twist · Post by **Twist** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 9:49 am

The office staff is a definitely a mixed bag. Pay attention to where ted yells at his boss, that was put in there for more than just the reason of showing teds post-death release of anger. David dosen't seem to put all that much happenstance into his comics. I don't think this is the exception.

Bryce · Post by **Bryce** » Sat Dec 01, 2001 11:31 am

Interesting you would bring up the boss scene, Twist... I was thinking earlier that Jack said "You can't hurt him, Ted." Yet, Ted's perfectly capeable of KILLING the gunman...Now, as it was explained, so long as they believe they have an effect on the physical world, they do. If Ted were really as mad at his boss as he appeared, he WOULD have hurt him because he would have EXPECTED to hurt him... I see two possible explinations.1) Ted wasn't really mad. He was putting up an act.2) David slipped a bit on the continuity.This is probably a case of the latter, but if it turns out that Ted really isn't the one who's being damned for killing the shooter, then I have to be the most observant mo-fo on the planet. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/smile.gif">*raises the roof*------------------
<A HREF="http://www.nuklearpower.com/comic/multi/8bit.htm" TARGET=_blank>http://www.nuklearpower.com/comic/multi/8bit.htm</A>

PyroFox · Post by **PyroFox** » Sun Dec 02, 2001 2:13 am

Or, there's possibility #3: Ted knew he was dead, but with the prevlant ideads of ghosts being a sort of imaterial observer most of the time, he didn't expect to be able to affect anyone untill later.Also, in that particular strip when he says "Rember a couple years back, that girl I..." I'm assuming the last word is "liked", but it's nearly illegible. No offense intended, it's just really hard to read.------------------
"Few things are harder to put up with than a good example."
- Mark Twain

Twist · Post by **Twist** » Sun Dec 02, 2001 4:22 am

Im inclined to agree with pyrofox because in that scene ted seemed to be in the mindset of "If Im already dead, then nothing I do matters" He even says that when jack tells him hitting his boss wont do anything. He says somthing to the degree of "I know but it felt good to try". I don't think emotion so much as belief has as much to do with effecting the physical world. I think this because of shauna trying to stop the bullet in a scene, aswell as a veriety of other times where they had done emotional things to effect the world to no effect. I think jack is not supposed to reveal that they can still effect the physical world, because his position seems to be to serve the natural order of events. He seems to have done it when, and only when they would have figured it out by themselves, because he is iterested in saveing one of their souls.

Yawgmoth · Post by **Yawgmoth** » Sun Dec 02, 2001 5:26 am

I'd just like to say the afformentioned possiblity 2 is very unlikely..

Terrycloth · Post by **Terrycloth** » Sun Dec 02, 2001 9:11 am

Jack kept saying 'you can't do that'. 'You can't stop him', 'you can't hurt him', etc. Meaning 'you aren't allowed', as it turned out, but it was supposed to be mistaken for 'are unable to'.