If Meighan's Professor is Doctor Why....

Postby Gormenghastly on Wed Mar 27, 2002 7:46 pm

.... then could The General be Doctor Why's nemesis?

Going back to the Doctor Who origins, things seem to fit. Timelords who leave their home planet nearly always took titles that start with "the" (The Doctor, The Master, The Rani, The Meddling Monk), so The General is in line name-wise. The General has demonstrated an ability to travel through time, which up-to-no-good Timelords always have.

So could it be that The General is the Faans universe equivalent of The Master? Or is Doctor Why just along for the ride because someone's messing with time?
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Postby Wish on Thu Mar 28, 2002 5:08 am

Y'know.. I've never seen much Dr. Who, so I don't feel qualified to comment on this theory's accuracy, but, from a layperson's standpoint, it seems fesable. Good thoughts, gorm!

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Postby Maccabee on Thu Mar 28, 2002 7:25 am

You missed The War Chief in your list of expatriate Time Lords. He was one of the chief villains in "The War Games," the last Second Doctor story (not counting all the "The n Doctors" stories, that is). That was always one of my favorites.

Now that Romana is also an exile, I wonder what name she's adopted for herself. "The Fake Princess"? "The Babe"?

I still prefer Fred.

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Postby Tom the Fanboy on Thu Mar 28, 2002 9:24 am

On 2002-03-28 07:25, Maccabee wrote:

Now that Romana is also an exile, I wonder what name she's adopted for herself. "The Fake Princess"? "The Babe"?

I still prefer Fred.

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mmmmmmmm...........Fred.............
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Postby Nullset on Thu Mar 28, 2002 9:33 am

The Fred? It just doesn't roll off the tongue. :wink:

It's a good thesis, would probably work well. I just don't buy it, though. T seems to like using the "themes" of specific shows, but never actually goes whole hog to emulate them. Rather, the opposite, actually.

I'm also skeptical, since the Skify fight the improbable and paranormal, but when it comes down to it, their foes are the dark sides of humanity. (IMHO, btw. It would take some serious Faans! analysis to show this, and I don't ahve the bandwidth or the time.) The General being a near immortal alien from an advanced civilization trying to subvert human history across the Multiverse isn't nearly as startling or terrifying as The General being an earthling (human may not be technically true) from Earth's near future (sorta) and doing the same.

But noticing the use of the "The Generic Title" methodology was an interesting find.
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Postby Gormenghastly on Thu Mar 28, 2002 3:23 pm

Wish wrote:
I've never seen much Dr. Who
It's probably too late to start now. Doctor Who is one of those things if you don't get started on it as a kid, it's really hard to develop a taste for it as an adult.

Maccabee wrote:
You missed The War Chief in your list of expatriate Time Lords. He was one of the chief villains in "The War Games," the last Second Doctor story (not counting all the "The n Doctors" stories, that is). That was always one of my favorites.
Oh yeah, the guy who was messing with history via the poor man's TARDISes called SIDRATs. I love Patrick Troughton, but that story is 5 hours long, so I've only seen it maybe twice. I also left out (on purpose cuz he didn't fit the pattern) that good guy Buddhist monk in the final Third Doctor story who regenerated into himself.

Maccabee wrote:
Now that Romana is also an exile, I wonder what name she's adopted for herself. "The Fake Princess"? "The Babe"?
"The Lady Who Foolishly Thought It Would Be Fun To Stay In A Small Universe With A Robotic Dog Which Can't Even Cross A Piece Of Cellotape Without Faltering".... Oh wait, that's almost as long as her actual name. "Ex-Mrs. Tom Baker"... nah. "The Wanderer", no wait, some Timelord called Dion's already taken that one. "The Prettiest Nose In Britain"... probably not, but probably true, so I'll stop now.

Nullset wrote:
It's a good thesis, would probably work well. I just don't buy it, though. T seems to like using the "themes" of specific shows, but never actually goes whole hog to emulate them. Rather, the opposite, actually.
Very good point, and one I hadn't thought of. Given the twist we saw with Mulder and Sully, if anything Doctor Why is likely to be in league with The General.

And while I'm seeing crazy things.... Doctor Why's hair, glassees, and face in the March 27 strip reminds me of the lead singer from the Buggles. So of course now I have lyrics to the effect of "Braino killed the comic book star" repeating in my head endlessly. Wonder if they'll let me have Shanna's Mom's room....
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Postby Maccabee on Thu Mar 28, 2002 9:10 pm

"Branio killed the Comic Book Star" -- that's a filk waiting to happen. If you write the whole thing it will make me all shiney and happy.

Besides, you can't have too many early '80s references. :smile:

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Postby Strangeone on Fri Mar 29, 2002 1:43 am

I haven't seen much Dr. Who, either. I caught the last five minutes of a Tom Baker episode on a PBS station a few months ago, but haven't been able to find it since. From what I saw though, the show looks awesome.
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Postby SteveB on Fri Mar 29, 2002 7:01 am

On 2002-03-29 01:43, Strangeone wrote:
I haven't seen much Dr. Who, either. I caught the last five minutes of a Tom Baker episode on a PBS station a few months ago, but haven't been able to find it since. From what I saw though, the show looks awesome.


Tom Baker had a certain arch quality, almost as if he was about to step out of the frame and join the MST3K boys in lampooning the whole thing, that makes his episodes probably the only ones an adult who isn't already a fan can watch enjoyably.

(I'm editing this because on rereading I realized someone might think I didn't realize that Tom Baker was long before MST3K. Of course I do; I was watching him before there was Comedy Central -- or MTV, for that matter. My point was Baker's Doctor was always just this side of self-mockery.)

And most American fans of my generation first became aware of the show through him, as the previous doctors didn't get imported over here until after he made a big splash on PBS.

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<font size=-1>[ This Message was edited by: SteveB on 2002-03-29 07:34 ]</font>
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Postby KingLeon on Fri Mar 29, 2002 10:07 am

MST didn't start on Comedy Central... started on some local station in some small town... can't remember when.
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Postby SteveB on Fri Mar 29, 2002 10:43 am

On 2002-03-29 10:07, KingLeon wrote:
MST didn't start on Comedy Central... started on some local station in some small town... can't remember when.


The Tom Baker "Dr. Who" premiered on my local TV station in 1984, I believe (at least when they canceled it in 1995 a fan complained on a newsgroup and mentioned that it had been on for 11 years). The MST official website says the show premiered on KTMA in Minneapolis on Thanksgiving Day, November 24, 1988.

I was wrong about the MTV thing, though. I was confusing watching "Dr. Who" on Channel 9 (KETC) in St. Louis with watching back-to-back episodes of "The Prisoner" and "Monty Python," which they were showing in the 70s. My bad. They ran them essentially the same night and times, and I spent 1978-1983 in Ohio, so I confused the before and after.

Isn't Google wonderful?

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Postby Muttley on Fri Mar 29, 2002 12:35 pm

SteveB wrote:
I was confusing watching "Dr. Who" on Channel 9 (KETC) in St. Louis with watching back-to-back episodes of "The Prisoner" and "Monty Python," which they were showing in the 70s

Hey, guys! I think we've got Union Jackie in disguise here!

Damn, that's a bloody good disguise, too . . .

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Postby Strangeone on Fri Mar 29, 2002 12:47 pm

MST3K officially began in around 1989, I believe. It was a public access show based in I think Michigan. Consequently, none of the episodes from its brief public access run will ever be commerically available because they didn't go through the official channels for the film rights when they made the episodes.
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Postby SteveB on Fri Mar 29, 2002 3:24 pm

On 2002-03-29 12:35, Muttley wrote:
Hey, guys! I think we've got Union Jackie in disguise here!


I think I resent this, but I'm not sure. I certainly am not, "Oh, it's British it must be cool!" or anything like that. You'll find an awful lot of people over here who liked those particular three shows. I also loved "Blake's 7," but I've never been a particular fan of "Red Dwarf."

How I got them confused:

Although I was born in St. Louis, I grew up mostly in a small rural town where Stu would have been one of the mainstays of the science fiction club, if we had had one. I went to college in Ohio, then dropped out after two years and lived a couple of years in St. Louis. During that time, "The Prisoner" and "Monty Python" were on back-to-back on Channel 9 (KETC), the local public television station, on Sunday night at 10:30 (after the local news on the commercial stations, which is at 10:00 in the Midwest).

Then I went back to school in Ohio, where I didn't watch TV at all, then on to grad school, where I first got cable three months before MTV first aired. Dropped out of grad school, drifted awhile, and returned to St. Louis in 1983.

Poor, I didn't have cable again, and I watched very little TV, but one thing I did watch was "Dr. Who," which ran on Channel 9 on Sunday nights at 10:30.

Then I got married, had a kid, got divorced, attended my first Convention, where I met the woman I was really meant to be with the rest of my life, and the rest, as they say, is history. But you can see why, over a decade after the fact, the two periods of Sunday night Channel 9 viewing get confused.

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Postby Maccabee on Fri Mar 29, 2002 3:54 pm

Curiously enough, my early exposure to Doctor Who was also on Channel 9 -- the Channel 9 out of North Jersey (WOR, Secaucus, NJ if I remember right), which is a commercial station.

The first episode I remember seeing was from the middle of Inferno, the last story of Third Doctor Jon Pertwee's first season. I've been hooked ever since, and BBC Video now has far too much of my money because none of my local stations broadasts the thing.

I'm also working on building a complete set of the Target novelizations, but one of them runs for something like $70 online, and it'll be a while before I'm rich (or desperate) enough to fork over that much for a dinky little paperback. Hell, I was getting 'em 3 for a dollar way back when.

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Postby Grifter on Fri Mar 29, 2002 11:19 pm

For anyone who cares.

MST3K was not originally public access. It was a local channel show, which is almost as bad. Anyway, it began in 1988 on KTMA-TV in my current city of residence, The Twin Cities (St. Paul-Minneapolis). After that it was picked up by comedy central.

And now you know.
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Postby Ray Radlein on Fri Mar 29, 2002 11:37 pm

On 2002-03-28 15:23, Gormenghastly wrote:
Wish wrote:
I've never seen much Dr. Who
It's probably too late to start now. Doctor Who is one of those things if you don't get started on it as a kid, it's really hard to develop a taste for it as an adult.


My wife and I didn't see our first episodes of Doctor Who until after we were married (by which time we were, well, adults). It would have been around late '85 or maybe 1986 sometime. In fact, we didn't even know what it was that we were watching -- we had missed the first few minutes, and, hence, the opening credits.

The episode in question was, by coincidence, the very first Tom Baker episode, "Robot." By the time Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart complained, "Just once, I'd like to run into an Alien Menace which wasn't immune to bullets!" I was hooked. Or maybe it was the following exchange between The Brigadier and The Doctor:

Brigadier: ...so all of the nations decided to get together and share their nuclear launch codes. Of course, the only country they could all trust with this secret information was Great Britain.

Doctor: Of course. After all, the rest are all just foreigners, aren't they?

Brigadier: (with no apparent irony) Quite.



We were both utterly hooked. When South Carolina Public Television stopped showing Doctor Who episodes, I began to drive, each Friday night, from our house in Columbia all the way to Angie's mother's house in Aiken, VCR in tow, to tape the Doctor Who broadcast from WCES in Augusta, Georgia. And then I would pack up the VCR, get back in the car, and drive back home. Just under two hours of driving to tape an hour and a half of TV (later, I would make the same trip to tape Red Dwarf, Fawlty Towers, and Blackadder's Christmas Carol, among other things).

Modulo one or two missing episodes, we have everything from late in Patrick Troughton's tenure through to the end of the series on tape. We have also bought several of the BBC videotapes. And now that they are coming out on DVD, we are buying them again. I was actually able to buy Doctor Who DVDs as Valentine's Day presents for Angie (don't worry; they weren't the only things I got her), and have her be thrilled to receive them.

So yeah, I gotta say that I think you can get into Doctor Who even if you come to it as an adult. :grin:




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Postby Muttley on Sat Mar 30, 2002 3:06 am

SteveB wrote:
I thinkI resent this, but I'm not sure. I certainly am not, "Oh, it's British it must be cool!" or anything like that. You'll find an awful lot of people over here who liked those particular three shows. I also loved "Blake's 7," but I've never been a particular fan of "Red Dwarf."

Apologies, Steve, I meant no disrespect, and I should have added a smiley to indicate tounge-in-cheek or something. Its just that I find it a bit bizarre that so much British programming is regarded so highly in the USA.

As I've said before, much of the later Doctor Who leaves me cold. The earliest ones (William Hartnell, Patrick Troughton) had an edget to them that the later ones lost.

I remain fond of The Prisoner even though it is essentially unresolved; it's so stylish that much can be forgiven.

Python I have no time for at all. There's maybe one funny moment out of the whole lot. Otherwise its mostly crudity, schoolboy humour and irrelevant silliness. Not for me.

With Blakes 7 I could never get over the dreadful cardboard scenery, not to mention the mostly wooden acting "Aaaargh, my implant hurts!". Thunderbirds had better actors.

To be fair, I experienced all of these as I was growing up, and may revise my opinion if I get the chance to see some of it again. My son is now watching Doctor Who videos borrowed from the library, and I seem to be much more interested in Leela in "The Invasion of Time" than I remember from the first time around :smile:

Red Dwarf is a later phenomenon, and again seems to have aimed low: Cat was much more catlike in the earlier episodes, now he's just a vain humanoid, and Lister gets cruder as the show evolves.

The local library has just acquired the TV miniseries of Dune; and that did impress me. They paid proper attention to the book, and captured the feel of it very well. What did you think?

Regards,
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Postby FrustratedPilot on Sat Mar 30, 2002 11:10 am

I got into <i>Doctor Who</i> in high school. The first one I saw was "Android Invasion". Eventually, I subjected my 12th Grade English class to a listening of the origin of the Daleks LP (which I believe my brother still has). Tom Baker got me hooked but Peter Davison was my favorite Doctor.

I never saw <i>Blake's 7</i>, but I have one of the novelizations. Servalan strikes me as being the very model of a modern skiffy major...I think you know the next word. :smile:

Sorry to hear about the Queen Mum. I am wearing black today.
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Postby FrustratedPilot on Sat Mar 30, 2002 11:14 am

Maccabee wrote:
I'm working on building a complete set of the Target [Dr. Who] novelizations, but one of them runs for something like $70 online, and it'll be a while before I'm rich (or desperate) enough to fork over that much for a dinky little paperback. Hell, I was getting 'em 3 for a dollar way back when.


Which one are you talking about? (I have a fairly good collection, not very extensive, but fairly good.)
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