Greetings from NYC

Animaniac · Post by **Animaniac** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 12:45 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>Originally posted by FrustratedPilot:
I had the suspicion that the rhetoric from the Race conference would lead events in this direction, but I'm sure there wasn't anybody in the nation prepared for the magnitude of the horror we are seeing.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>It may not have been the race conference. Today is the anniversary of the signing of the Camp David Accords. IIRCBy some reports, the fourth plane was heading towards Camp David when it "crashed" near Pittsburg. Also it was reported that one of the passengers got a cell phone 911 call of the plane saying they were being hijacked. That fourth crash obviously missed, either something happened on board, or they were shot down.Animaniac
::The good of the many...::

Muttley · Post by **Muttley** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 12:56 am

Nicolas Juzda said:
 I just found out about all this, and am still absorbing it all, but I don't think anyone has yet claimed responsibility. The last major act of terrorism on U.S. soil that I can recall turned out to be domestic. Just something to remember.
---Nick, Nick, I want it to be some nutter; some small band of nutters, maybe; but, look at it, this was a carefully planned and executed operation by many people, a lot of them deliberately choosing to die for their cause. I don't know of anything other than religion (not saying what flavour, that has still to be exposed) that can replace the individual's survival instinct. The only other candidate I can come up with is anti-capitalism, and they have shown no signs of deliberate, cold planned suicide attacks.I know flyers: no pilot would fly into a building. Maybe the United captain at Pittsburgh managed to keep control long enough to foil any hijackers intentions. But the others were suicidal replacements, fanatics. Hell, airliners are easy enough to point through the sky; there is the dreadful possibility that you could learn enough from Flight Simulator to do this awful thing.Muttley

Merrow · Post by **Merrow** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 1:10 am

A friend I went to school with was supposed to be at work at the WTC today, but this morning she didn't feel well and called in sick. My next door neighbor's cousin works there and of her there is no word. Another friend is stuck in her office building and cannot leave since the city is shut down. (She hopes to catch a ferry later) Two friends of mine work in goverment offices in DC, but I have heard through other friends that they are safe. I am glad I live in the middle of nowhere. I am afraid because I live near a military base. I really want my neighbor's cousin to be ok. I really hope we don't do something stupid in our grief. Merrow

NathanAlderman · Post by **NathanAlderman** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 1:37 am

I work at a newspaper. It's my day off. When I was awakened at 10:15 to come into work, I thought it was a joke.I'll say two things. First, I can assure y'all that as of the last time I'd heard, we don't know WHO perpetrated this. Pointing the finger at religious fundamentalists is jumping to conclusions in the worst way.Second, New Yorkers-- supposedly among the most callous and jaded of people-- are flocking into hospitals to donate desperately needed blood. That alone should help any bolster any flagging faith in humanity.This is unimaginable. But I have faith that we'll find the people responsible and show them how the U.S. reacts to being attacked.-- Nathan

Maccabee · Post by **Maccabee** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 2:51 am

I have two brothers in Manhattan and two in-laws who commute to the city for work. Fortunately all are fine (though we had an anxious few hours not being able to get through on the phone before finding this out). My brother-in-law has a lot of friends who worked in the World Trade Center.As for who launched the attack -- Arafat has offered his condolences to the American people. Some West Bank Palestinians are celebrating in the streets. Having sympathy for a terrorist attack does not mean involvement in the terrorist attack, though. We just need to wait and see.What should U.S. response be? Any sort of compromise with the terrorists will encourage future attacks. Striking back will create martyrs and more people who want to hit the U.S. back. We seem damned no matter what we do.

Tom the Fanboy · Post by **Tom the Fanboy** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 3:25 am

This certainly isn't the kind of thing I wanted to herald my return to the boards.This certainly isn't the kind of thing I want to herald anything.The crashes of these four jets is a horrible horrible thing. Last I heard the death calculation was at least 10,000. more than 200 of those being on the jets.It's just F***ing unbelievable what a bunch of guys with knives can do.I agree with everyone that despair, finger pointing, and panic are all bad ideas right now. We must be strong and attempt to help however we can.As far as information goes this is what I've heard. All the planes were filled with fuel for trips to California. They were all taken over so quickly that the crew could not put out an emergency signal. The flight that crashed in Pennsylvania turned back at Cleveland and had changed it's transponder destination to "DCA" shortly before crashing.
The jets were under terrorist control for less than 20 minutes before the first crash.I hope that all of your loved ones make it out of this alive and safe.------------------
Tom the Fanboy
http://www.geocities.com/tee-moss[begin Fans! code]
E(xkodt)M++FF+++A++W+++FCt++(s)Ip20000406f1mcKt+cCp- -bw++Ll++
[end Fans! code]

Czhorat · Post by **Czhorat** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 5:55 am

Greetings fellow Fen.The mood here is more than a bit shaken, as I'm sure you can imagine. Words just fail me to describe this. My hopes are with any of the unfortunate souls trapped there. --LSid

T Campbell · Post by **T Campbell** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 6:01 am

<A HREF="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/Forum16 ... 00726.html" TARGET=_blank>Two minds, one thought.</A>[This message has been edited by T Campbell (edited 09-11-2001).]

FrustratedPilot · Post by **FrustratedPilot** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 6:27 am

I had the suspicion that the rhetoric from the Race conference would lead events in this direction, but I'm sure there wasn't anybody in the nation prepared for the magnitude of the horror we are seeing.I am considered an infidel here. But my prayers are with you, Czhorat.

Amorph · Post by **Amorph** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 7:17 am

This is shocking... My brother is in NYC, and so is one of my best friends.My prayers go out to everyone in NYC and DC, and to the passengers of the plane that crashed outside of Pittsburg.Using passenger jets as weapons... gah... some people are gleefully, incalculably evil. The casualties will be in the tens of thousands.God help us all.
------------------
James"Without death there would be very little progress." - Steve Jobs

Kurt · Post by **Kurt** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 7:31 am

Didn't Tom Clancy write a book with a similar ending a few years ago? Of course, that was one plane into the Capitol building, if I recall.

Wish · Post by **Wish** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 7:35 am

Here's a small quote from an email I sent to a friend recently: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>More than one person on Project Infinity [The MUX where I usually go to role play] today has wistfully wished for a few heroes of the superhuman varriety to pop up out of the mix to avert further casualties. Someone else commented that 'if Superman was here' this never would have happened. More 'should have, would have, could have' supposing, but I can't bring myself to be annoyed at it. Unlike the more sarcastic Bush-bashing, this kind of desire seems to come from a deeper and more heartfelt area of the human psyche. There's something innocent and touching about people hoping for Superman. This desire for a godlike human hero to arrive and 'fix everything' is at once childish and heartbreaking. Moreso now that over 450 'mortal' heroes, policemen and firemen, have been reported missing in New York. If only...<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I want Superman too. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/frown.gif">-Wish

Nullset · Post by **Nullset** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 7:37 am

Unfortunately, that Clancy novel didn't do what Faans! quoted recently, that sci-fi should prevent the future.I'm being snide, just feeling sick.Nullset out.

Czhorat · Post by **Czhorat** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 7:45 am

Thanks all for your kindness. On days like this, it's good to feel like part of a community. That feeling should have been part of my answer to Rikk's "What do you owe Fandom" question. Times like this I envy those who do have religion. I can understand the old saying about no atheists in foxholes. I'm staying true to my beliefs and neither praying nor asking for prayers, but a part of me wishes that I had faith.If anyone needs word from somebody in NYC and can't reach them because the trunks are busy, email me at Czhorat@yahoo.com or post here. Being stuck on this island has to be good for something.As T said, fear is their biggest weapon. I'll close with a few lines from Herbert:"I must not fear. Fear is the mindkiller. Fear is the little-death that brings total obliteration. I will face my fear. I will permit it to pass over and through me. And when it is gone I will turn the inner eye to see its path. Where the fear has gone there will be nothing. Only I will remain."
[This message has been edited by Czhorat (edited 09-11-2001).]

Thor Thorvaldson, Jr · Tue Sep 11, 2001 7:53 am

Y'know, I have a two-year old and one on the way. This kind of horror makes me wonder why I should even bring kids into a world like this. With the kind of crap we humans do to each other and to the earth, it makes me think sometimes that we just might deserve to be blown up.Thor
My faith in the human race is nearly exhausted at this point...

GarrisonBeckett · Post by **GarrisonBeckett** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 9:16 am

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:<HR>
I want Superman too. <IMG SRC="http://www.keenspace.com/forums/frown.gif">
<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>I appreciate that. This morning I thought of the Man of Steel, and Batman with the Batjet, and the Enterprise doing a little time-warp, and Early Edition, and all the delightful fantasy worlds in which evil attacks without remorse, without warning. And it sadly occurred to me that there are no superheroes to thwart evil for us -- perhaps a drawback of fandom is that we ignore threats like terrorism, leaving the evil of the world in the hands of the imaginary; or worse, not seeing the threat at all, because its form is so mundane compared to the flashy, moustache-twirling villains who make spectacles of themselves and their deeds. I always wondered why villains did that, why they didn't just kill the hero and be done with it. Maybe that's just too close to real life.But this is a real chance, I think. For each of us to be heroes without the powers, without the money, without the glamour, and without the costumes, for each of us to give back in our own way, and do what we can for the survivors. Giuliani said the death toll "could be horrendous," but I don't know what that means. In my own happy fantasy world, *one* is a horrendous number, especially in something like this. "This is our nation. We all belong to it. Our enemy doesn't expect us to fight for it." Well Rikk, here's our chance. ^_~--GB"We will not go quietly into the night!" -ID4

Nullset · Post by **Nullset** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 9:34 am

Hang in there Czhorat, and don't dispare Thor. This is s terrible, terrible thing, true. But all is lost when good people give up hope.In my travels about the net, I've discovered that Fandom is alive, and doing its part. Slashdot was cooking, even when CNN was down. ArsTechnica has folks who normally digitally encode sci-fi and animation discussing capturing the latest news and streaming it across the web from their own servers.And even this little message board does its part. Thanks T.Nullset out.

Wish · Post by **Wish** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 9:57 am

Oh ladies and gentlemen...I am.. nearly beyond words. When I walked into work and was told what happened.. I laughed. I laughed! I knew that my co-worker could NOT have been serious. This bizarre story had to be some kind of joke that he was perpetrating on me, just to break up the monotony of the work day. Oh Lord.. I am so sorry now that I laughed.The weekend before last, I drove through New York for the first time in my life with two of my dearest friends in the world. I remember thinking 'One day this city may fall, but through MY lifetime, it will always stand. This is the eternal skyline. It can only soar higher.' I cannot believe how wrong I was. The whole world feels unreal. Is this how it is to live in an alternate universe? It seems like we've been thrust into the kind of world described by science fiction writers, an elaborate set constructed for a military dry run of disaster-response training. Is this what shock is like? I should be at work, but the University in Atlanta is shut down. I should be putting away books now, not trying to get my arms around that footage of the second jet slamming into the tower. Nothing more to say.. How do we express what happens to us when we live through this kind of experience?I am just wildly thankful for those I love, and that they are all still here with me. I hope the same can be said for all of you. Wake up, America. Rise up. Stand up, America. We must see to our own. This cannot be allowed to break us down into dispair.-Wish

Muttley · Post by **Muttley** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 10:51 am

Czhorat; glad to hear from you. The business Internet pipe has been out today, or I'd have posted earlier. I had to wait until I got home.
All the respondants here have actually paused for thought. I really fear that many of your countrymen may not.This is a terrorist attack on the worlds richest nation by religious fundamentalists. Not a declaration of war by an identifyable country. There is no enemy that can be the target of military retaliation.Then again, say, for the sake of argument, it is proven to be Swiss-sponsored. You destroy Switzerland; it becomes a land of glass mountains. (and I lose a very good friend. And your position becomes weaker).But there are expatriot Swiss all over the world, and every one of them now hates you, and is prepared to die for the memory of the cantons.-Before you engage an enemy, it is crucial to know what their goal is. What if that goal is an isolationist, paranoid and trigger-happy USA?The prosperity of the Western world is built on trade. And Trade has just been conspicuously attacked.Is it beyond the bounds of possibility that this is a very clever anti-capitalist demonstration?Thor: Nullset has it right - never lose hope in the future! If you do, then the enemy has already won. I too fear for the future my son will face; but he'll be there to face it, as well prepared as I can make him, and that's the most important thing I can do.Our thoughts, sympathies and prayers are with the victims and their families. And with George W. Bush.Muttley
I never thought I'd feel worse than I did when I saw the Challenger die.

FrustratedPilot · Post by **FrustratedPilot** » Tue Sep 11, 2001 11:18 am

1) If my brother had been more successful at the tryouts for a TV game show he wanted to enter, we might have gone to NYC--perhaps even today--for the taping.2) If my family had been wealthier, I might have completed flight school, and at this time in my life might have been a crewman on a jetliner.3) I've heard from one cyber-acquaintence who had a loved one at the Pentagon. His office was in the part of the building that took the brunt of the damage from the plane's impact. But at the time, he was on the other side of the building attending to business of his, and survived.4) I've heard from another cyber-acquaintence who is in Somerset County where that other plane went down. We haven't heard back from him about whether his family got through this and in what condition.We are all connected.