Retard Question about Advertising

Cinematic · Post by **Cinematic** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 6:16 pm

Retard question: does Keenspace let its hosted sites use ads OTHER than the ones in the ***advertisement*** tag? I was thinking of putting some text-based ads (such as google) ads on my site... well, ok, when I get readers.... but still. I don't see anything about it in the Keenspace Terms of Agreement, but then the TOA dont mention the ***advertisement*** tag either. So... can I?

It's kind of a moot point because Google wants people to be 18 before they can use their advertising (damn me being 17!!! I can go to rated R movies, drop out of high school, and have sex, but I can't use a lousy advertisement??), but I just thought I would ask for future reference.

Nagrom
Cinematic -- Because Movies are Better than Real Life

Hobolenno · Post by **Hobolenno** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 6:58 pm

This might just be me, but "WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD YOU WANT TO HAVE MORE ADS IN YOUR SITE?!"

ZOMBIE USER 17021 · Post by **ZOMBIE USER 17021** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:03 pm

Greed is a powerful . . . thing.

<sup>Um . . . got any greed metaphors on ya by chance?</sup>

Platypus · Post by **Platypus** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:33 pm

Hobolenno wrote:This might just be me, but "WHY IN THE WORLD WOULD YOU WANT TO HAVE MORE ADS IN YOUR SITE?!"

ROFL ! That's a good one

<-- damn why don they have rofl ?!?

Cinematic · Post by **Cinematic** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:37 pm

I've seen people do it right, actually. Choppping block is a great example (the one with 2 ps, not 3... thats just the one in my head). Well, ok, no page can really do ads "right", but I really, really need cash. I'm thinking small text-based links on the pages that ARENT the index page or comics. That way theyre not as annoying, and I'm a kid preparing to go to college with an almost-zero family income. ANYTHING right now would be a help.

...anyone in Manhattan need their dog walked?

Nagrom
Cinematic -- Because Movies are Better than Reality

Faub · Post by **Faub** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:40 pm

Ad sites like burst.net require you to get at least 50k hits before they'll advertise with your site. If Keenspace already has a deal with whoever you want to advertise with then you're unlikely to get a deal made anyway. I would say don't worry about it until you get some serious page views showing on your webalizer (not hits, page views). Upwards of 5 digits a month.

Cinematic · Post by **Cinematic** » Thu Dec 18, 2003 7:48 pm

Oh, I know. I'm just wondering if Keenspace will ALLOW people to use other ad sources on a site hosted by them. Dont see why not, but then again I dont see why they would either....

Reinder · Post by **Reinder** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:50 am

Google Adsense has no minimum pageview requirement and offers text-based ads. They do however have stringent quality criteria - better make sure your website is easy to navigate and has good comics on it.

Post by **Kisai** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 12:17 pm

Just to point out, when hard(sexylosers) was on keenspace he had several advertisements in addition to the burst one. (the JList ad was perpetually glued to the page)

You can, just you can not "stack" advertisements for anything.

The basic rules for ads are:

They must appear when the user first visits the site... so it has to be above the fold (first 300-something vertical pixels) so the user doesn't have to scroll to see them.

They can not be stacked with other ads, which means you can't have a series of 60pixel high ads all in a table so there is no space between them.

Text ads can be interspersed between image ads if you are desparate... but if your comic is not the first thing I see after the ad, people like me will not read the first page and instead goto the archives where there is less clutter.

rules about 200x40 and 88x31 ads are usually the same... paid ads can not be stacked, but "unpaid links" can. The reason is to not associate one ad with another. Like if I put megatokyo (unpaid) and the burst banner together stacked it would look like burst supports megatokyo or vice versa. Hence why they have to have space.

But you are a fool if you voluntarily put more ads on your site that slows it down. Porn/Warez sites tend to have so much clutter that only desparate idiots will wade through the junk ads to actually find the content... and even then you need an IQ of at least 115 to figure out what is content and what is advertisement.

Top "lists/votes" are the best example of contentless ad stacking. By definition they are "content portals" and are usually not allowed to even have paid advertisements because the people visiting are NOT going to ever click on the advertisement because they are intending to click on one of the votes off the site. Usually hosting one of these sites will get you kicked from the ad hosts site.

All of the burst ads on keenspace are "under keenspace" and which means that the few areas that might be TOS violations under the ads (adult sites for example, people stacking ads) but because they are not the only thing there, it's not really a violation.

CodeGuy · Post by **CodeGuy** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 1:01 pm

List sites are bad? Do you just mean that hosting one is bad? How about having a vote-link to Buzz Comix?

http://www.buzzcomix.net/index.php

Is that OK?

Cinematic · Post by **Cinematic** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 2:27 pm

Dankeshein, Kisai-san. Much appreciation.

Post by **Kisai** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 2:43 pm

CodeGuy wrote:List sites are bad? Do you just mean that hosting one is bad? How about having a vote-link to Buzz Comix?

http://www.buzzcomix.net/index.php

Is that OK?

No, hosting one with the intention of earning ad revenue from it is bad because advertisers will -NOT- pay portal sites.

Other reasons advertisers pull out:
1. Copyright infringement
2. Illegal activity
3. Adult/Unprofessional/Unacceptable content

So most people on keenspace/keenspot only see the "good" stuff

There was one site that myself, Kelly and nate had an argument over the content. I deemed it inapproriate because it depicted underage children in sexual situations, where as Nate rather not do anything about it. However somehow the author managed to hear about this argument and simply pulled the site.

Still, what one person views as innappropriate another may not. Examples being what the "I feel so pwned" thread in GD is about, where Keenspot's "core" comic authors would pull out if any hardcore adult material were to be on keenspot... however... yet nobody even questioned the content of the existing sites when they were overly violent.

Advertisers are usually PG-friendly, and would pull their advertising from burst if they knew burst was putting their ads on certain sites. This is only discovered when the site becomes uber popular and the advertiser doesn't want to pay the site for the advertising cost because it was innappropriate.

This also touches on the "keen branding" idea in the same pwned thread. Where if it were to really be established, all other advertising would have to be kicked off the site. It would be just the branding items.

I'm usually against the "Branding" concept because I found the sites that started doing it (xoom now nbci, and yahoo) were extemely persistant about forcing ads on the site even if the ad had nothing to do with the content.

Case in point, ads for software on a site advocating software piracy or downloads of mp3's.

Innappropriate ads on keenspace would be anything that webcomic readers would never buy... as we seem to have found that a lot of the readers are also pretty cheap... just like people who actually buy comic books. They will spend all their money collecting a series, but would never actually buy any of the stuff advertised unless it was being plugged by the comic characters. Which then those comics are known as sell-outs.

CodeGuy · Post by **CodeGuy** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 2:52 pm

OK, maybe I'm just totally misunderstanding. How does this relate to vote sites? Is having a link to a vote site like the one that I listed bad?

Post by **Kisai** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:13 pm

Okay....

If you put a "PAID" link on your site, you have rules to follow, no stacking, must be visibile above the fold of the page.

If you put a "UNPAID" link, like "Vote for me" you have to still follow the rules from above and can not stack it with the other advertisers, but you can put it anywhere on your page. However keep in mind that people don't scroll down the entire page.

If you are HOSTING A "TOP" SITE, (which you can not do on keenspace) you can't have any paid advertisements since the page is nothing but advertisements.

If you are LINKED FROM a "TOP" site, you must be returning the favor, likewise on any drop-down.

IMO, I hate how "voting" systems work as they are easily cheated by having a small-but-unemployed fanfase.

CodeGuy · Post by **CodeGuy** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:24 pm

Thanks.

YarpsDat · Post by **YarpsDat** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:25 pm

CodeGuy wrote:OK, maybe I'm just totally misunderstanding. How does this relate to vote sites? Is having a link to a vote site like the one that I listed bad?

No. it's just that:
making your own vote site is a bad idea if you want to earn ad money.

Phalanx · Post by **Phalanx** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 3:36 pm

Kisai wrote: IMO, I hate how "voting" systems work as they are easily cheated by having a small-but-unemployed fanfase.

I have to agree on that. I went Buzzcomix surfing the other day- To my surprise a good portion of the top 100 comics were still crap.

I supposed I get a wee bit peeved when I see a 'comic' which is actually isn't a comic but a bunch of photos of transformer toys being shifted around beating more deserving comics like Alpha Shade or No Room for Magic.

*shudder*

CodeGuy · Post by **CodeGuy** » Fri Dec 19, 2003 4:28 pm

They claim that one computer can only vote once a day. Oh well.

I really don't care about the ranking. I've gotten a few hits from it in the last couple days, so more people have seen my comic. I just like the little bit of extra exposure.

I saw it on Count Your Sheep and figured that if Adis liked it, then I might as well give it a try.

Post by **Kisai** » Sun Dec 21, 2003 12:16 am

Hence 'small but unemployed fanbase'

Any dude and his 4 buddies can easy lay in 120 votes in a month. and because it temporarily gets to the top, then it attracts more temporary attention as people visit them and then go "ew, this is crap" and never come back.

Platypus · Post by **Platypus** » Thu Jun 14, 2007 9:07 am

People avoid ads like a plague. I really wonder how people make money on adsense

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Retard Question about Advertising

Retard Question about Advertising

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